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Thread: Hardcore/Punk Guide To Christianity

  1. #1
    Semi-Intelligent Entity xCrucialDudex's Avatar
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    Hardcore/Punk Guide To Christianity

    I've just found this:
    http://www.louisvillehardcore.com/ha...-christianity/

    Has anyone come across this earlier? Is it any good?

  2. #2
    Registered User lo0m's Avatar
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    it can be true in the global scope... but there is so many bullshit in there, that i won't finish it reading (stuck at ch 7)...
    Take the time. Don't be blind. You will find. An open mind. There's no need for you to tell me what I've done wrong. I can, can see, all this contradiction around me. I just, just want, I want to be free. Don't question my actions. I never said that I was flawless

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    Semi-Intelligent Entity xCrucialDudex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lo0m View Post
    it can be true in the global scope... but there is so many bullshit in there, that i won't finish it reading (stuck at ch 7)...
    You just read it through up to chapter 7?

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    Registered User lo0m's Avatar
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    yes, and finished it now and changed my (hot head) opinion.. it is good reading in global.. and i appreciate there's no christian-bashing in there.. its written sensitively and with respect.. still i see some minor misunderstanding there.. nothing serious.. thx for sharing :-)
    Take the time. Don't be blind. You will find. An open mind. There's no need for you to tell me what I've done wrong. I can, can see, all this contradiction around me. I just, just want, I want to be free. Don't question my actions. I never said that I was flawless

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    Administrator xsecx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lo0m View Post
    yes, and finished it now and changed my (hot head) opinion.. it is good reading in global.. and i appreciate there's no christian-bashing in there.. its written sensitively and with respect.. still i see some minor misunderstanding there.. nothing serious.. thx for sharing :-)
    like what?

  6. #6
    Administrator xsecx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xCrucialDudex View Post
    I've just found this:
    http://www.louisvillehardcore.com/ha...-christianity/

    Has anyone come across this earlier? Is it any good?
    it used to be included with records back in the 90s. can't remember who, but it's been around for a long time and was done in response to the large influx of tooth and nail bands and their ilk.

  7. #7
    Semi-Intelligent Entity xCrucialDudex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xsecx View Post
    it used to be included with records back in the 90s. can't remember who, but it's been around for a long time and was done in response to the large influx of tooth and nail bands and their ilk.
    Did you read it? What do you think about it? I still haven't read Intro entirely since I'm real busy these days but I will definitely go through this once I have some free time.

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    Being Mean CarlaRant's Avatar
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    Yeah, I remember reading this when I was first getting involved in punk/hc. It was in alot of zines that I picked up at shows. I skimmed through it just now to refresh my memory and it doesn't provide anything new when it comes refuting Christian beliefs, particularly in the hardcore scene. I agree that it is well written and fairly tolerant of Christians' beliefs. It's worth a read.

  9. #9
    Registered User lo0m's Avatar
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    Dusty: yeah, i was looking forward to this :-) but i will dissapoint you.. if you want to see the "other side" of the topic (or a very related one), then read Jacques Ellul's Anarchie et Christianisme (Anarchy and Christianity), particulary Adrien Duchosal's essay, which is in it.. that will give you totally different view on christianity than from a perspective of a US citizen or a punker. I'm not saying that it is a book, that will make you a christian, nor do I want that... but it's good to see the problem from different angle, isn't it?
    anyway - as i said - i have no problem with the text in global, just some particular ideas are based on misunderstandings.. one simple example of how worthless my complaints really are..
    look at chapter 8.. he is using verses from various Old Testament chapters (about facial hair for example) yet he doesn't point out that the main reason of Jesus' earthly life was to bring a new law, New Testament, which made a thick red line and changed many many things, most of all the conditions for entering heaven.. as i said - this is in no way serious complaint but if this text would be more complete i would be more likely to share it.. which i may do anyway..
    hope that satisfied your need for brainfood.. :-)
    Take the time. Don't be blind. You will find. An open mind. There's no need for you to tell me what I've done wrong. I can, can see, all this contradiction around me. I just, just want, I want to be free. Don't question my actions. I never said that I was flawless

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    Administrator xsecx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xCrucialDudex View Post
    Did you read it? What do you think about it? I still haven't read Intro entirely since I'm real busy these days but I will definitely go through this once I have some free time.
    yeah, and it's not bad. but it's also been well over 10 years since I read it.

  11. #11
    Administrator xsecx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lo0m View Post
    Dusty: yeah, i was looking forward to this :-) but i will dissapoint you.. if you want to see the "other side" of the topic (or a very related one), then read Jacques Ellul's Anarchie et Christianisme (Anarchy and Christianity), particulary Adrien Duchosal's essay, which is in it.. that will give you totally different view on christianity than from a perspective of a US citizen or a punker. I'm not saying that it is a book, that will make you a christian, nor do I want that... but it's good to see the problem from different angle, isn't it?
    anyway - as i said - i have no problem with the text in global, just some particular ideas are based on misunderstandings.. one simple example of how worthless my complaints really are..
    look at chapter 8.. he is using verses from various Old Testament chapters (about facial hair for example) yet he doesn't point out that the main reason of Jesus' earthly life was to bring a new law, New Testament, which made a thick red line and changed many many things, most of all the conditions for entering heaven.. as i said - this is in no way serious complaint but if this text would be more complete i would be more likely to share it.. which i may do anyway..
    hope that satisfied your need for brainfood.. :-)
    yeah, it's amazing how someone would ask you to explain a statement you'd made.

    I always find it funny that when people talk about religion they use the word misunderstanding when someone who doesn't believe points out inconsistencies. That it's not a matter of it not making sense, it's that the person talking somehow doesn't understand the subject matter. The use of the new law is by and large a copout. Especially since it doesn't replace all of the old law, just the ones that make jews, jews so the christians could set themselves apart and that was by culture and not by scripture.

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    Registered User lo0m's Avatar
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    sorry, i think i'm lost in your English now.. maybe will try to read it again later in the morning.. for now - as I said - i don't have any serious complaints about the text so i don't feel the urge to actually discuss it...
    Take the time. Don't be blind. You will find. An open mind. There's no need for you to tell me what I've done wrong. I can, can see, all this contradiction around me. I just, just want, I want to be free. Don't question my actions. I never said that I was flawless

  13. #13
    Administrator xsecx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lo0m View Post
    sorry, i think i'm lost in your English now.. maybe will try to read it again later in the morning.. for now - as I said - i don't have any serious complaints about the text so i don't feel the urge to actually discuss it...
    it's kind of weird that you'd say that the text is based on misunderstandings, but that wouldn't give you serious complaints?

  14. #14
    Registered User lo0m's Avatar
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    well, it maybe weird on your side of the ocean :-).. there are some statements used as arguments that - from my point of view - are not valid.. that doesn't mean that the other (the majority) arguments are not valid too. nor does that mean that the pamphlet is invalid in its whole meaning..so, again, and I would be really happy if you would remember it this time - stop putting words in my mouth. i have never stated that "the text is based on misunderstandings".. i said "i have no problem with the text in global, just some particular ideas are based on misunderstandings".. it would be propably better for both of us if you would just answer my posts if you want to and not try to reform/rewrite them. thanks (again)
    Take the time. Don't be blind. You will find. An open mind. There's no need for you to tell me what I've done wrong. I can, can see, all this contradiction around me. I just, just want, I want to be free. Don't question my actions. I never said that I was flawless

  15. #15
    Administrator xsecx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lo0m View Post
    well, it maybe weird on your side of the ocean :-).. there are some statements used as arguments that - from my point of view - are not valid.. that doesn't mean that the other (the majority) arguments are not valid too. nor does that mean that the pamphlet is invalid in its whole meaning..so, again, and I would be really happy if you would remember it this time - stop putting words in my mouth. i have never stated that "the text is based on misunderstandings".. i said "i have no problem with the text in global, just some particular ideas are based on misunderstandings".. it would be propably better for both of us if you would just answer my posts if you want to and not try to reform/rewrite them. thanks (again)
    How is asking for clarification of statements that are contradictory putting words in your mouth? If information put forward in a document isn't valid, even on some of the arguments, then it seems completely odd that you wouldn't have a problem with it. Then again, you follow an abrahamic religion so it makes sense that you're used to just ignoring things that don't make sense.

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