clothing line

[XBILLYX]

these guys are out of texas they have some pretty cool sxe shirts. some of their other clothing items i dont agree with but their cool check them out.http://www.stillhereclothing.net

[xsecx]

these guys are out of texas they have some pretty cool sxe shirts. some of their other clothing items i dont agree with but their cool check them out.http://www.stillhereclothing.net

you mean the ones the demonstrate that hardcore disagree's with christianity?

[xvunderx]

seems spot on to me, some good designs too.

[XBILLYX]

you mean the ones the demonstrate that hardcore disagree's with christianity?
your real quick dusty. you are a smart cookie

[xsecx]

your real quick dusty. you are a smart cookie

too bad you're not.

[XBILLYX]

too bad you're not.

iam not? its funny how you judge others so easly. when your not the sharpest tool in the shed

[xsecx]

iam not? its funny how you judge others so easly. when your not the sharpest tool in the shed

you've already demonstrated that you're not smart. many many times at this point. now, if you want to explain to me why I'm not the sharprest tool in the shed?

[XBILLYX]

you've already demonstrated that you're not smart. many many times at this point. now, if you want to explain to me why I'm not the sharprest tool in the shed?
because you keep judging me. yes i dont prove iam dump on here alot. but that makes you stupid to judge me. the thing is iam pretty damn smart. i may not show it here but in my schooling and my work i show it. showing you that i know so much isnt the biggest goal on my list. now what have you down with your life? did you go to college did you do anything? what kind of job do you have?

[xsecx]

because you keep judging me. yes i dont prove iam dump on here alot. but that makes you stupid to judge me. the thing is iam pretty damn smart. i may not show it here but in my schooling and my work i show it. showing you that i know so much isnt the biggest goal on my list. now what have you down with your life? did you go to college did you do anything? what kind of job do you have?

I keep "judging you" based on what you've said here. All I have to go on is what you've demonstrated here, which honestly makes you look like a moron. Now, how that makes me stupid to judge you based on your words, I'm not really sure.

what have I done with my life? Well for starters I was making 6 figures by the time I was 20, I bought my house when I was 21. I'm one of a very small group of people in the world that do what I do for a living and I do it quite well. I can't talk about what I'm doing now, but I will say that I've worked professionally in technology since I was 17 and am pretty damn sucessful at it. I've done system administration, data center planning, worked on mergers and acquistions. I've done information security and know more that I'd like to how credit cards work. I've worked with crypto hardware and giant databases.

so yeah, what have you done?

[XBILLYX]

I keep "judging you" based on what you've said here. All I have to go on is what you've demonstrated here, which honestly makes you look like a moron. Now, how that makes me stupid to judge you based on your words, I'm not really sure.

what have I done with my life? Well for starters I was making 6 figures by the time I was 20, I bought my house when I was 21. I'm one of a very small group of people in the world that do what I do for a living and I do it quite well. I can't talk about what I'm doing now, but I will say that I've worked professionally in technology since I was 17 and am pretty damn sucessful at it. I've done system administration, data center planning, worked on mergers and acquistions. I've done information security and know more that I'd like to how credit cards work. I've worked with crypto hardware and giant databases.

so yeah, what have you done?
jack shit. iam still inschool so i can get a job with skunk works or the black hole. but at the time i program and run cnc machines.

[xsecx]

jack shit. iam still inschool so i can get a job with skunk works or the black hole. but at the time i program and run cnc machines.

so how does this demonstrate that you're smarter than you portray here?

[XBILLYX]

so how does this demonstrate that you're smarter than you portray here?
i dont even know what to say. you ask a question i answer then you ask ho it proves my point. i dont know how to prove to you iam smart other then to again time and actually put work into my posts.

[xsecx]

i dont even know what to say. you ask a question i answer then you ask ho it proves my point. i dont know how to prove to you iam smart other then to again time and actually put work into my posts.

what I don't understand is why you'd make posts that aren't thought out and are completely wrong in the first place and not expect people to think you're a moron.

[XBILLYX]

what I don't understand is why you'd make posts that aren't thought out and are completely wrong in the first place and not expect people to think you're a moron.

i dont know how edge has lasted with people like you shoting kids down. so i guess we are even.

[xsecx]

i dont know how edge has lasted with people like you shoting kids down. so i guess we are even.

people like me? Shooting kids down who are wrong about things?

[XBILLYX]

people like me? Shooting kids down who are wrong about things?
yea you. iam wrong? about what other then my christianity?

[xsecx]

yea you. iam wrong? about what other then my christianity?

what, that's not enough?

[straightXed]

yea you. iam wrong? about what other then my christianity?

I'm just wondering why is the christianity excused from this?

[XBILLYX]

what, that's not enough?

no give me more!


I'm just wondering why is the christianity excused from this?

beacuse i already know you think iam wrong on that.

[straightXed]

beacuse i already know you think iam wrong on that.

So you are asking people to address all the things they think you are wrong about? Hasn't that already been going on? And weren't you against people "shooting you down" for the things you are wrong about?

[XBILLYX]

So you are asking people to address all the things they think you are wrong about? Hasn't that already been going on? And weren't you against people "shooting you down" for the things you are wrong about?
no iam asking dusty and no one has pointed out anything but christiany.

[straightXed]

no iam asking dusty and no one has pointed out anything but christiany.

Well maybe i'm reading a different thread? I mean for starters theres the thing about you saying its stupid to judge you based on what you present yet you try to make a judgement on dusty not being the sharpest tool based on nothing. Its all pretty wrong and its safe to say the judgement you made was wrong. And then theres the claim that dusty said something he didn't, you were wrong about that, i mean this is all happening right now, not like 3 weeks ago. Why can't you retain the things you were wrong about?

[xsecx]

no iam asking dusty and no one has pointed out anything but christiany.

what else have you talked about here besides that? I know this is a hard concept for you to grasp but "Shooting kids down who are wrong about things?" isn't just about you. Since your statement was about what I do to other people, not really sure why you want me to point out where you're wrong about things. But if you want to, you can make a list about wha tyou think about any given topic and I'm pretty sure I'll be able to show you where you're wrong on most things.

[mouseman004]

I keep "judging you" based on what you've said here. All I have to go on is what you've demonstrated here, which honestly makes you look like a moron. Now, how that makes me stupid to judge you based on your words, I'm not really sure.

what have I done with my life? Well for starters I was making 6 figures by the time I was 20, I bought my house when I was 21. I'm one of a very small group of people in the world that do what I do for a living and I do it quite well. I can't talk about what I'm doing now, but I will say that I've worked professionally in technology since I was 17 and am pretty damn sucessful at it. I've done system administration, data center planning, worked on mergers and acquistions. I've done information security and know more that I'd like to how credit cards work. I've worked with crypto hardware and giant databases.

so yeah, what have you done?


Thats ridiculously impressive, and it makes me feel relatively sad about my life lol

[XBILLYX]

what else have you talked about here besides that? I know this is a hard concept for you to grasp but "Shooting kids down who are wrong about things?" isn't just about you. Since your statement was about what I do to other people, not really sure why you want me to point out where you're wrong about things. But if you want to, you can make a list about wha tyou think about any given topic and I'm pretty sure I'll be able to show you where you're wrong on most things.

you have gotten me to change my views almost anywhere that i have argued with you when i was wrong. the only thing you havent made me change my mind about is christianity. most of the stuff you did well you made me see it differnt. christianty you made me feel stupid thats what i am talking about shoting kids down. you just seem to make it seem so wrong to be a christian you know what i mean? so rather then seeing your points i think alot of kids if their like me get madand claim up and dont see facts and dont see what your saying. but then again i dont care what you say anymore on that topic its my life and you can see it how you want. so heres my list.

christians.
vegans & christians

[xsecx]

you have gotten me to change my views almost anywhere that i have argued with you when i was wrong. the only thing you havent made me change my mind about is christianity. most of the stuff you did well you made me see it differnt. christianty you made me feel stupid thats what i am talking about shoting kids down. you just seem to make it seem so wrong to be a christian you know what i mean? so rather then seeing your points i think alot of kids if their like me get madand claim up and dont see facts and dont see what your saying. but then again i dont care what you say anymore on that topic its my life and you can see it how you want. so heres my list.

christians.
vegans & christians

you can't be vegan and christian for the same reason you can't be straight edge and christian. Christ fed people fish. You can't have say that eating animals is wrong when jesus did. The whole point being that if you believe in the religion and honestly and truthfully follow it, then you can't disagree with god on any level and about anything. If you really honestly believed that jesus was god and everything that goes with worshipping something, then you'd have to throw away and individual thought and completely and totally adopt the beliefs of the religion.

[XBILLYX]

you can't be vegan and christian for the same reason you can't be straight edge and christian. Christ fed people fish. You can't have say that eating animals is wrong when jesus did. The whole point being that if you believe in the religion and honestly and truthfully follow it, then you can't disagree with god on any level and about anything. If you really honestly believed that jesus was god and everything that goes with worshipping something, then you'd have to throw away and individual thought and completely and totally adopt the beliefs of the religion.

yes dusty i have heard this argument. i know where you stand here. but like i said before you wont change my mind on that. so see me as a fake or what not i dont care. i am drug free and happy. plus i am no vegan any ways why should i not eat meat?

[xsecx]

yes dusty i have heard this argument. i know where you stand here. but like i said before you wont change my mind on that. so see me as a fake or what not i dont care. i am drug free and happy. plus i am no vegan any ways why should i not eat meat?

why won't it change your mind though?

[XBILLYX]

why won't it change your mind though?

because iam hard headed stubborn and lived my life this way to long to change. i dont want to change i like the way iam. you ever hear that saying about how to change you have to want to change? well heres living proof.

[straightXed]

because iam hard headed stubborn and lived my life this way to long to change. i dont want to change i like the way iam. you ever hear that saying about how to change you have to want to change? well heres living proof.

Even if it means living in contradiction or lying to yourself?

[xvunderx]

because iam hard headed stubborn and lived my life this way to long to change. i dont want to change i like the way iam. you ever hear that saying about how to change you have to want to change? well heres living proof.

Thing is no one said you can't live drug free and Christian, only that the 2 labels can't mix, sXe is too strong a stance, you you either believe drinking and god are wrong, or you believe that you believe that drinking isn't for you but is socially ok. if you feel the latter, then you just drop a label that isn't you any way, if you beleive the former, then you have problems, because your whole faith is a lie to you, and you would rather live a lie than think for yourself and evaluate your life.

I think it;s funny that you are still in school and think you're too old to change, your not even close to half way through your life and you think you should set yourself in stone. Way to stand in place.

A person should examine their life, and make it fit what they believe, and a person should evaluate and improve from birth till death. I know if I hit 80 I'll still make sure I live my beliefs, and understand what i believe and why. Your a kid and have given up on that. That isn't stubborn, that's just sad.

[XBILLYX]

Even if it means living in contradiction or lying to yourself?

yea. because its lying to myself to you not me. i dont see the problem the whole facts you gave me i dont see as correct.


Thing is no one said you can't live drug free and Christian, only that the 2 labels can't mix, sXe is too strong a stance, you you either believe drinking and god are wrong, or you believe that you believe that drinking isn't for you but is socially ok. if you feel the latter, then you just drop a label that isn't you any way, if you beleive the former, then you have problems, because your whole faith is a lie to you, and you would rather live a lie than think for yourself and evaluate your life.

I think it;s funny that you are still in school and think you're too old to change, your not even close to half way through your life and you think you should set yourself in stone. Way to stand in place.

A person should examine their life, and make it fit what they believe, and a person should evaluate and improve from birth till death. I know if I hit 80 I'll still make sure I live my beliefs, and understand what i believe and why. Your a kid and have given up on that. That isn't stubborn, that's just sad.

i dont set this in stone. i know change will come its just not in my christianity.

[straightXed]

yea. because its lying to myself to you not me. i dont see the problem the whole facts you gave me i dont see as correct.



i dont set this in stone. i know change will come its just not in my christianity.

that sounds pretty set in stone to me.

[XBILLYX]

that sounds pretty set in stone to me.

yea my christianty beliefs are pretty set in stone your right. its something i believe very deeply in. i dont know. i can see you guys dont agree with it. but how is it effecting you? am i forcing it on you? or the scene? am i here telling you your all damned to hell if you dont believe in what i do? no. maybe it is all a lie. i dont know. all i can do is live the best life i can.

on a side note about my life being set in stone. what i want for my life is but for all i know years down the road i will find thats not what i want any more and do something new. i cant tell about that stuff now it hasnt happen.

[straightXed]

yea my christianty beliefs are pretty set in stone your right. its something i believe very deeply in. i dont know. i can see you guys dont agree with it. but how is it effecting you?

How can you be sure you won't change your views on christianity and why wouldn't you be open to seeing those views in a new light. This is more about what you have said and how it effects you.



am i forcing it on you? or the scene?

Well why aren't you?



am i here telling you your all damned to hell if you dont believe in what i do? no. maybe it is all a lie. i dont know. all i can do is live the best life i can.

Don't you believe that we are all dammned to hell? Don't you believe we need saving?


on a side note about my life being set in stone. what i want for my life is but for all i know years down the road i will find thats not what i want any more and do something new. i cant tell about that stuff now it hasnt happen.

Then that should include christianity and your statement, "i dont set this in stone. i know change will come its just not in my christianity", shouldn't imply that you will never change from christianity.

[XBILLYX]

How can you be sure you won't change your views on christianity and why wouldn't you be open to seeing those views in a new light. This is more about what you have said and how it effects you.

is it?


Well why aren't you?

because i dont think it helps are cause. your not going to change because i try beating it into you. i dont think i can force it on you.




Don't you believe that we are all dammned to hell? Don't you believe we need saving?

yea but iam not telling you that am i? i never have said it.


Then that should include christianity and your statement, "i dont set this in stone. i know change will come its just not in my christianity", shouldn't imply that you will never change from christianity.

yea it should but iam not changing that any time soon.

[xvunderx]

yea my christianty beliefs are pretty set in stone your right. its something i believe very deeply in. i dont know. i can see you guys dont agree with it. but how is it effecting you? am i forcing it on you? or the scene? am i here telling you your all damned to hell if you dont believe in what i do? no. maybe it is all a lie. i dont know. all i can do is live the best life i can.

They are deep enough for you to contradict them.

Nobody cares that you are Christian, only that you profess 2 sets of beliefs that contradict each other. It's the contradiction that is a problem .

[straightXed]

is it?

Yes




because i dont think it helps are cause. your not going to change because i try beating it into you. i dont think i can force it on you.

But your religion suggests you should, are you in someway hoping that i will follow jesus?






yea but iam not telling you that am i? i never have said it.

So what are you doing to save me? Ultimately wouldn't you want to see the entire hardcore scene saved from hell by following your faith?



yea it should but iam not changing that any time soon.

Time is rather subjective, but its nice to know that your christianity is subject to change.

[xsecx]

yea. because its lying to myself to you not me. i dont see the problem the whole facts you gave me i dont see as correct.


so what part don't you see as correct?

[XBILLYX]

They are deep enough for you to contradict them.

Nobody cares that you are Christian, only that you profess 2 sets of beliefs that contradict each other. It's the contradiction that is a problem .

they dont he never drank the whine he never made any one drink it he used it as a sybol of his blood. no where in there does it say i have to drink whine. but you will say your meant to be like him i know. i believe if the water was bad you would drink whine rather then die. maybe not i dont know.


But your religion suggests you should, are you in someway hoping that i will follow jesus?

nope iam not hoping thats your choice.


So what are you doing to save me? Ultimately wouldn't you want to see the entire hardcore scene saved from hell by following your faith?

nothing. yea that would be cool but it wont happen.


Time is rather subjective, but its nice to know that your christianity is subject to change.

thats good to know.


so what part don't you see as correct?

that jesus drank whine and forced others. you make him out as a dictator. but can we not fight about this again. i know your views you know mine i think your a cool guy and just rather not fight about this.

[straightXed]

nope iam not hoping thats your choice.

Not really sure what you mean. Are you saying you are hoping its not my choice or that you aren't hoping and it is my choice? Very confusing grammar. Either way aren't you supposed to want to spread the word of jesus and let people know the "good news".




nothing. yea that would be cool but it wont happen.

Well if you think it would be cool why aren't you trying to save people? It definitely won't happen if you don't let people know that they need to accept jesus into their life. I mean if we don't we all go to hell and you are happy to just sit back and watch that happen, thats not very christian dude.





thats good to know.





Yeah because it already looks like you are deviating from core elements of christianity.

[xvunderx]

they dont he never drank the whine he never made any one drink it he used it as a sybol of his blood. no where in there does it say i have to drink whine. but you will say your meant to be like him i know. i believe if the water was bad you would drink whine rather then die. maybe not i dont know.

Except there has been proof from the Bible Jesus drank alcohol in the part where he compares himself to John the Baptist which has proved you wrong on this before, and the only alcohol was safe to drink crap has been disproved over and over here before too with the historical fact that many many people before and during the time of Christ including john the baptist didn't drink it.

The fact that he CHOSE to give wine at the wedding banquet, not as a symbol of his body (which lets face it, he could have offered water then too and not wine) but for the party.

You don't have to drink alcohol, and the bible doesn't say you have to. However by claiming sXe you state your beliefs that drinking is wrong all of it, and that the world would be better off without it. Buy doing so you are saying that Jesus was wrong to give wine to those people, he was wrong for drinking wine, and therefore you are a blasphemer because you claim to follow Jesus, but you judge him, and say that he was wrong, that you god was incorrect.

All this has been covered over and over and over and over again. You can be drug free and Christian. Just can't be sXe.

[XBILLYX]

Not really sure what you mean. Are you saying you are hoping its not my choice or that you aren't hoping and it is my choice? Very confusing grammar. Either way aren't you supposed to want to spread the word of jesus and let people know the "good news".

the later. i cant make you do things and it seems your pretty much decided not to be a christian. i do spread the word just not forcefully and when its right. you cant just go every where screaming it from the roofs. people will think your nuts and close you out


Well if you think it would be cool why aren't you trying to save people? It definitely won't happen if you don't let people know that they need to accept jesus into their life. I mean if we don't we all go to hell and you are happy to just sit back and watch that happen, thats not very christian dude.

its the same as above when i get the chance and its right i do. but i just can force it on people.


Yeah because it already looks like you are deviating from core elements of christianity

how is that? because ia m not on here forcing my beliefs on you?


Except there has been proof from the Bible Jesus drank alcohol in the part where he compares himself to John the Baptist which has proved you wrong on this before, and the only alcohol was safe to drink crap has been disproved over and over here before too with the historical fact that many many people before and during the time of Christ including john the baptist didn't drink it.

The fact that he CHOSE to give wine at the wedding banquet, not as a symbol of his body (which lets face it, he could have offered water then too and not wine) but for the party.

You don't have to drink alcohol, and the bible doesn't say you have to. However by claiming sXe you state your beliefs that drinking is wrong all of it, and that the world would be better off without it. Buy doing so you are saying that Jesus was wrong to give wine to those people, he was wrong for drinking wine, and therefore you are a blasphemer because you claim to follow Jesus, but you judge him, and say that he was wrong, that you god was incorrect.

All this has been covered over and over and over and over again. You can be drug free and Christian. Just can't be sXe.

did you not understand that i know your argument and didnt care it wasnt going to change me? i dont agree and many others dont either. we arent jews jesus was do you think we are meant to convert to be like him to?

[xvunderx]

did you not understand that i know your argument and didnt care it wasnt going to change me? i dont agree and many others dont either. we arent jews jesus was do you think we are meant to convert to be like him to?

Christianity is Judaism + 1

You are supposed to believe your God is perfect. Also, you might not want to change your life, but when handed PROOF you are expected to not ignore it and keep on like it never happened. You go on and on when what you say has been proved to be a lie, and you know it, and so do all of us.

Why do you want to lie to yourself? Why not accept either you believe your God to be flawed, or you believe that drinking is ok, just not something you chose to take part in?

Why do you chose to not learn or think? I used to think as a child I could walk to the end of a rainbow because i saw it touch the ground, when presented with the fact that a rainbow was just light split by rain, I no longer believed I could walk to the end of the rainbow. Should I keep trying because that's how I lived?

[XBILLYX]

Christianity is Judaism + 1

You are supposed to believe your God is perfect. Also, you might not want to change your life, but when handed PROOF you are expected to not ignore it and keep on like it never happened. You go on and on when what you say has been proved to be a lie, and you know it, and so do all of us.

Why do you want to lie to yourself? Why not accept either you believe your God to be flawed, or you believe that drinking is ok, just not something you chose to take part in?

Why do you chose to not learn or think? I used to think as a child I could walk to the end of a rainbow because i saw it touch the ground, when presented with the fact that a rainbow was just light split by rain, I no longer believed I could walk to the end of the rainbow. Should I keep trying because that's how I lived?

you tried to walk to the end of the rainbow? can you give me the verse where the wedding you talk of is at? judaism is not christianity we dont even have the same beliefs or laws. they dont believe jesus was the messiah. there is so many differences in are two religons. just like your proof of buddist and hindus being like christians they believe in idols and made up men and we belief in a GOD.

[xvunderx]

you tried to walk to the end of the rainbow? can you give me the verse where the wedding you talk of is at? judaism is not christianity we dont even have the same beliefs or laws. they dont believe jesus was the messiah. there is so many differences in are two religons. just like your proof of buddist and hindus being like christians they believe in idols and made up men and we belief in a GOD.

Old testament, and the water to wine miracle at the wedding, it's a pretty big and well known miracle.

Christianity is Judaism plus Jesus and all that comes with him, Islam is Christianity Plus Mohamed and all that comes with him.

[straightXed]

the later. i cant make you do things and it seems your pretty much decided not to be a christian. i do spread the word just not forcefully and when its right. you cant just go every where screaming it from the roofs. people will think your nuts and close you out

But you aren't even trying. And people think you are nuts already but for other reasons.




its the same as above when i get the chance and its right i do. but i just can force it on people.

so you have intent to go against a large part of hardcore because you think it would be neat to have a completely christian scene? Don't you see how that will nullify the whole scene into not being hardcore anymore, ok you don't think its likely to happen but the point here is it actually goes against what hardcore is. Hardcore actively challenges christianity and essentially "preaches" values that contradict christianity so why don't you think you should be vocal about your faith within hardcore, i would guess its because you realise it has no place there but are really struggling to accept that. It will never be right for you to convert people to christ within hardcore, you are spending your time with people you believe will go to hell, people who openly defy your religion and regard it as wrong and you do nothing to save them from that. I mean do you think we are all lost and doomed but don't feel strongly enough about your faith to show us whats right? I mean we are all extremely vocal about the idea of hardcore and how what you believe really doesn't fit with it, maybe hardcore means more to these people than god does to you as we are prepared to continue being vocal about our beliefs, perhaps because they have a real belonging here.




how is that? because ia m not on here forcing my beliefs on you?

You haven't explained to me how your beliefs work together, its not possible for you to convince people of much when you are displaying inconsistancy. But even excusing that you haven't even made an attempt to show christianity to others here as something worthy of being a part of, instead you keep it well to yourself like some guilty secret that doesn't belong. Now theres obviously a reason for that and i'm not asking you to change or deviate from your natural way of dealing with this but rather have a look at how obvious it is that your beliefs don't really have a place within a scene like hardcore. Hardcore is not a vehicle to spread the word of god, and spreading the word of god should be something you want to do. Hardcore actually is rather opposite to the things you as a christian should value and feel worthy of spreading around. Its quite possible that hardcore will stifle your faith in god considerably.

[XBILLYX]

Old testament, and the water to wine miracle at the wedding, it's a pretty big and well known miracle.

Christianity is Judaism plus Jesus and all that comes with him, Islam is Christianity Plus Mohamed and all that comes with him.

o yea thats pretty well known. but you didnt give me the verse so i could go see where it says he drank the whine.

lol who told you that? we arent jews and jews arent christians. we are differnt in every way. so stop saying that. its wrong. if you ask a jew he isnt going to say, "i am a christian" in less he has accepted christ as his savior. we arent the same religion!

[SgtD]

o yea thats pretty well known. but you didnt give me the verse so i could go see where it says he drank the whine.

lol who told you that? we arent jews and jews arent christians. we are differnt in every way. so stop saying that. its wrong. if you ask a jew he isnt going to say, "i am a christian" in less he has accepted christ as his savior. we arent the same religion!
reread the post above moron!

[xvunderx]

o yea thats pretty well known. but you didnt give me the verse so i could go see where it says he drank the whine.

lol who told you that? we arent jews and jews arent christians. we are differnt in every way. so stop saying that. its wrong. if you ask a jew he isnt going to say, "i am a christian" in less he has accepted christ as his savior. we arent the same religion!

I didn't say you were the same religion, only that you aren't as different as you seem to think.

Jesus isn't mentioned in the water to wine story as drinking wine, but it;s safe to say that if he's making wine to give to people he's pretty cool with the consumption of alcohol, something you think he's wrong about.

[XBILLYX]

I didn't say you were the same religion, only that you aren't as different as you seem to think.

Jesus isn't mentioned in the water to wine story as drinking wine, but it;s safe to say that if he's making wine to give to people he's pretty cool with the consumption of alcohol, something you think he's wrong about.

you didnt say we are the same? really then what did you mean by"christianity is jujudaism? we arent? how arent we differnt? yes but your argument is that he drank it.

[xvunderx]

you didnt say we are the same? really then what did you mean by"christianity is jujudaism? we arent? how arent we differnt? yes but your argument is that he drank it.

I said that Christianity is Judaism + 1, jesus bing the +1 and the old testament being part of judaism.

My argument wasn't that the water to wine miracle was an example of him drinking, just that it was an example of him condoning it.
The proof of him drinking wine is when he cmpared himself to john the baptist and mentions that John differes from jesus because john abstains from alcohol. None of this is new.

[XBILLYX]

I said that Christianity is Judaism + 1, jesus bing the +1 and the old testament being part of judaism.

My argument wasn't that the water to wine miracle was an example of him drinking, just that it was an example of him condoning it.
The proof of him drinking wine is when he cmpared himself to john the baptist and mentions that John differes from jesus because john abstains from alcohol. None of this is new.

ok give me the verse where it says this. its not just plus jesus silly girl its more then jesus.

[xsecx]

ok give me the verse where it says this. its not just plus jesus silly girl its more then jesus.

go back and search my posts where I quote scripture it's all there.

and no, you seriously don't understand the basic history of your own religion and it's really sad. the "differences" between christians and jews are 1, historical and not scriptual and 2, jesus being the messiah. The differences that makes you not a jew and not follow judaic law aren't real. You should actually still be following judiac law, the reason you don't is because of politics, not scripture and not jesus's teachings.

[xvunderx]

ok give me the verse where it says this. its not just plus jesus silly girl its more then jesus.

True, it's Jesus AND Judaism

[XBILLYX]

go back and search my posts where I quote scripture it's all there.

and no, you seriously don't understand the basic history of your own religion and it's really sad. the "differences" between christians and jews are 1, historical and not scriptual and 2, jesus being the messiah. The differences that makes you not a jew and not follow judaic law aren't real. You should actually still be following judiac law, the reason you don't is because of politics, not scripture and not jesus's teachings.

really? how to you come up with that? show me the proof that this is really what happen.


True, it's Jesus AND Judaism

dusty iam not looking back in your post to find this give me the verse and i will look it up. iam not asking you to write it or anything just give me the verse. i have ask three times and you havent provided. this leads me to believe that you are going by hear say something you read that some one else posted. maybe dusty. xvunderx give me the verse.

[xsecx]

really? how to you come up with that? show me the proof that this is really what happen.


give me scriptual proof as to why you shouldn't be subject to judiac law and customs.



dusty iam not looking back in your post to find this give me the verse and i will look it up. iam not asking you to write it or anything just give me the verse. i have ask three times and you havent provided. this leads me to believe that you are going by hear say something you read that some one else posted. maybe dusty. xvunderx give me the verse.
you could look it up as easy as they could though, so I don't see why you're asking for something that you should actually know better than an atheist.

[XBILLYX]

give me scriptual proof as to why you shouldn't be subject to judiac law and customs. .

there is none. we dont have the same bibles as them and we dont have the same laws as them why dont you give me the proof of the politacl reasons you talk of?



you could look it up as easy as they could though, so I don't see why you're asking for something that you should actually know better than an atheist.

yea but she says she knows it so prove it. if she knows it why cant she just give it to me? why should i do the work when its her argument? isnt it you that said i should research my arguments better? so why shouldnt she?

[xsecx]

there is none. we dont have the same bibles as them and we dont have the same laws as them why dont you give me the proof of the politacl reasons you talk of?


what do you mean there is none? All the original christians were jewish and your bible includes most of the torah. Why don't you have the same bibles? Why don't you have the same laws?





yea but she says she knows it so prove it. if she knows it why cant she just give it to me? why should i do the work when its her argument? isnt it you that said i should research my arguments better? so why shouldnt she?

because she's already stated the miracle in the bible. The text of which is already on this site, if you want to see specific scripture and you know the source of it, then why wouldn't you look it up?

[XBILLYX]

what do you mean there is none? All the original christians were jewish and your bible includes most of the torah. Why don't you have the same bibles? Why don't you have the same laws?


really we do have the same laws? o yea your right i always see christians involved in pass over. i know use christians only eat kosher foods. we are split off of them yes but we arent the same as them. its like the hardline stuff you explained to me hardline was a branch of sxe but completely differnt.




because she's already stated the miracle in the bible. The text of which is already on this site, if you want to see specific scripture and you know the source of it, then why wouldn't you look it up?

beacuse she is just saying what you have already said she hasnt seen it if she cant tell me where to find it. if she cant give me the verses her argument is false. shes just using what others have said.

[xsecx]

really we do have the same laws? o yea your right i always see christians involved in pass over. i know use christians only eat kosher foods. we are split off of them yes but we arent the same as them. its like the hardline stuff you explained to me hardline was a branch of sxe but completely differnt.


so why don't you and why aren't you? the god is the same god. so why are the instructions and traditions of the jewish god no longer applicable to you?





beacuse she is just saying what you have already said she hasnt seen it if she cant tell me where to find it. if she cant give me the verses her argument is false. shes just using what others have said.

it's called the search function, use it. her argument isn't what verse are you looking for, the one where jesus compares himself to john the baptist? or the wedding? and to that end, are you actually trying to argue that jesus didn't drink wine?

[XBILLYX]

so why don't you and why aren't you? the god is the same god. so why are the instructions and traditions of the jewish god no longer applicable to you?

beacuse it was sarcasm. because when jesus came he started to teach people to do the things differnt but the jews didnt believe him.



it's called the search function, use it. her argument isn't what verse are you looking for, the one where jesus compares himself to john the baptist? or the wedding? and to that end, are you actually trying to argue that jesus didn't drink wine?

john the baptist. and yes that the bible doesnt say he drank whine. i believe you can make this argument dusty i know you know where the stuff is i want her to prove me wrong if she wanted to start it why cant she finish it?

[xsecx]

beacuse it was sarcasm. because when jesus came he started to teach people to do the things differnt but the jews didnt believe him.


but jesus followed judiac law. if he did, then why shouldn't his followers? Where in the bible does it say you don't have to?



john the baptist. and yes that the bible doesnt say he drank whine. i believe you can make this argument dusty i know you know where the stuff is i want her to prove me wrong if she wanted to start it why cant she finish it?
because it's an arugment that's already been made completely on this site, that she was referencing, she wasn't making a new point. and yes, the bible does say he drank wine. the last supper is an example of this. Even if you want to claim incorrectly that jesus didn't drink wine, you're still stuck with the wedding where he supplied wine to people and therefore condoned it's use.

[xsecx]

you tried to walk to the end of the rainbow? can you give me the verse where the wedding you talk of is at? judaism is not christianity we dont even have the same beliefs or laws. they dont believe jesus was the messiah. there is so many differences in are two religons. just like your proof of buddist and hindus being like christians they believe in idols and made up men and we belief in a GOD.

so what makes you belief in a god real and hindu's beliefs in many gods idols? What made up men? How much do you actually know about other religions?

[XBILLYX]

so what makes you belief in a god real and hindu's beliefs in many gods idols? What made up men? How much do you actually know about other religions?

the made up man is budda. not much about these ones but i know alot about jews and catholics. christians arent the same as catholics either.

[XBILLYX]

because it's an arugment that's already been made completely on this site, that she was referencing, she wasn't making a new point. and yes, the bible does say he drank wine. the last supper is an example of this. Even if you want to claim incorrectly that jesus didn't drink wine, you're still stuck with the wedding where he supplied wine to people and therefore condoned it's use.

it never said he drank the whine at the supper the others did not him. yes and as before he was a man. drinking whine is not a sin but nowhere does it say God drank whine the bible stats that jesus was with out sin, that doesnt mean he didnt make mistakes he was here to see how hard it was for men to live without sin. olus earlyier i said i didnt want to argue about it i knew where you all stood. i knew where i stand. i had stopped arguing there and i didnt want to argue here about it.

[xsecx]

the made up man is budda. not much about these ones but i know alot about jews and catholics. christians arent the same as catholics either.

How is he a made up man? So you know a lot about catholics, who are actually christian, but then say they aren't? If you don't know that much about any other religion then how do you know you're right and they're not?

[XBILLYX]

How is he a made up man? So you know a lot about catholics, who are actually christian, but then say they aren't? If you don't know that much about any other religion then how do you know you're right and they're not?

how is he made up? ok you know men that can sit under a tree for that long? we arent catholics. why do you keep trying to make all these groups one we arent. maybe i show start calling you all hardliners! how many writings can you find budda in other then their book? how many books tell of jesus from differnt time periods all saying the same thing? any of the groups that have set out to prove it wrong have found it to be true.

[xsecx]

it never said he drank the whine at the supper the others did not him. yes and as before he was a man. drinking whine is not a sin but nowhere does it say God drank whine the bible stats that jesus was with out sin, that doesnt mean he didnt make mistakes he was here to see how hard it was for men to live without sin. olus earlyier i said i didnt want to argue about it i knew where you all stood. i knew where i stand. i had stopped arguing there and i didnt want to argue here about it.

so wait, jesus was capable of mistakes now? So you think that jesus would provide wine to others but wouldn't consume it? Why? It was the culture then and it's still the culture now, so why wouldn't he drink it? I mean he provided it and condoned it for others. What makes you think he didn't share the meal with the others at the last supper? Especially since it was a passover meal and keeping with tradition jesus would have drank wine then. At the end of hte day you're still contradicting god and your issue still remains. jesus had no problem providing wine to others, which oyu still think is wrong.



you also forgot this part "but jesus followed judiac law. if he did, then why shouldn't his followers? Where in the bible does it say you don't have to? "

[XBILLYX]

so wait, jesus was capable of mistakes now? So you think that jesus would provide wine to others but wouldn't consume it? Why? It was the culture then and it's still the culture now, so why wouldn't he drink it? I mean he provided it and condoned it for others. What makes you think he didn't share the meal with the others at the last supper? Especially since it was a passover meal and keeping with tradition jesus would have drank wine then. At the end of hte day you're still contradicting god and your issue still remains. jesus had no problem providing wine to others, which oyu still think is wrong.



you also forgot this part "but jesus followed judiac law. if he did, then why shouldn't his followers? Where in the bible does it say you don't have to? "

i didnt forget it i just didnt have a answer at the time. remember your problem with me not doing proper research first?

why do you insist on argueing with me? you arent going to change what i think. there are so many edge kids that are christian and so many bands that are why would your argument change what i think when i have support from them?

[xsecx]

how is he made up? ok you know men that can sit under a tree for that long?


you do realize that jesus is supposed to have done a lot more things a lot stranger than sitting under a tree. There's not even anything supernatural attributed to him. I guess the irony of you calling him made up based on the story of the bodhi tree when you think a guy can be born from a virgin mother, walk on water and various other miracles is real is lost on you.




we arent catholics. why do you keep trying to make all these groups one we arent. maybe i show start calling you all hardliners! how many writings can you find budda in other then their book? how many books tell of jesus from differnt time periods all saying the same thing? any of the groups that have set out to prove it wrong have found it to be true.
What was the first church? What are all other churches based on? What makes someone a christian and what precludes catholics from that definition? I don't even understand this part so you're going to need to restate it. "how many writings can you find budda in other then their book? how many books tell of jesus from differnt time periods all saying the same thing? any of the groups that have set out to prove it wrong have found it to be true."

are you saying that people have proved the bible right?

[xsecx]

i didnt forget it i just didnt have a answer at the time. remember your problem with me not doing proper research first?

why do you insist on argueing with me? you arent going to change what i think. there are so many edge kids that are christian and so many bands that are why would your argument change what i think when i have support from them?

But you're so sure that you're not, why would you have to research it?

why do you insist on not actually addressing the root problem? Why do you think you can contradict or disagree with god? There are no edge kids who are christian, that's what you're failing to understand. There are a group of kids, who like you are unable/unwilling/incapable of actually looking at the situation and coming to terms with your own religious beliefs. instead you just want to take the parts you like and ignore the parts you don't like. Of course someone who was actually religious and someone who actually cared wouldn't do this.

[XBILLYX]

But you're so sure that you're not, why would you have to research it?

why do you insist on not actually addressing the root problem? Why do you think you can contradict or disagree with god? There are no edge kids who are christian, that's what you're failing to understand. There are a group of kids, who like you are unable/unwilling/incapable of actually looking at the situation and coming to terms with your own religious beliefs. instead you just want to take the parts you like and ignore the parts you don't like. Of course someone who was actually religious and someone who actually cared wouldn't do this.

because i dont want to give you false info.

o your so right dusty. we are a small number lol thats bs. we are a small part and we arent taking what we want. we just are actually involved and know what we know. you read the bible or have apparitly but you dont understand what it is to be a christian. you were raised as one yes but you did accept jesus as your savior or you feel it in you. i cant explain it to some one that doesnt know what iam talking about but its there.

[xsecx]

because i dont want to give you false info.


then how can you make statements of what something is or isn't if you have to research it?




o your so right dusty. we are a small number lol thats bs. we are a small part and we arent taking what we want. we just are actually involved and know what we know. you read the bible or have apparitly but you dont understand what it is to be a christian. you were raised as one yes but you did accept jesus as your savior or you feel it in you. i cant explain it to some one that doesnt know what iam talking about but its there.

how is that bs? how are you not ignoring the parts of the bible that you don't like? You would think someone who took jesus as their savior wouldn't think jesus was wrong and certainly wouldn't feel like they could call his actions and teachings wrong. But hey, i guess I'd have to be a christian to understand that, right? That's the entire point kid, you're saying one thing and you're living your life completely differently. If you actually DID accept jesus you'd accept all of it, not just the parts you already agree with. you'd surrender your own thoughts and morals and accept his completely. But you don't. You pick and choose and ignore the parts that don't. It's also not even getting into the whole being into hardcore and christian being against each other on a basic level.

[XBILLYX]

then how can you make statements of what something is or isn't if you have to research it?

because if i state what i feel you will ask for proof.




how is that bs? how are you not ignoring the parts of the bible that you don't like? You would think someone who took jesus as their savior wouldn't think jesus was wrong and certainly wouldn't feel like they could call his actions and teachings wrong. But hey, i guess I'd have to be a christian to understand that, right? That's the entire point kid, you're saying one thing and you're living your life completely differently. If you actually DID accept jesus you'd accept all of it, not just the parts you already agree with. you'd surrender your own thoughts and morals and accept his completely. But you don't. You pick and choose and ignore the parts that don't. It's also not even getting into the whole being into hardcore and christian being against each other on a basic level.

LOL ok. you know me i pick and choose. i just have been living a lie havent i.

[xsecx]

because if i state what i feel you will ask for proof.


yeah, except you should have an understanding of why you feel what you feel. that also shouldn't require research. It only needs to be researched when you're told something, you believe it but you don't know why you believe it.






LOL ok. you know me i pick and choose. i just have been living a lie havent i.
actually you are. you're the one that says he's your savior but that you're right and he's wrong.

[xvunderx]

LOL ok. you know me i pick and choose. i just have been living a lie havent i.

At last you're beginning to get it!

[XBILLYX]

yeah, except you should have an understanding of why you feel what you feel. that also shouldn't require research. It only needs to be researched when you're told something, you believe it but you don't know why you believe it.

theirs alot i havent learned i am still finishing the bible. its a big book. i havent read everthing and evertime i read a book i learn something new.



actually you are. you're the one that says he's your savior but that you're right and he's wrong.

i never said he was wrong.

[xsecx]

i never said he was wrong.

so you think giving alcohol to others is ok and right?

[XBILLYX]

so you think giving alcohol to others is ok and right?

lol look dusty when i became edge i didnt learn we were flat out against everthing about alchohol. i had been told that we didnt drink do drugs and we keep are selfs health and that we were against the majority that do drink. i never took it as we hated everthing about it. yes you have said it all the way since the begining of my time but it never really set in till now.

[stepinsideissue]

lol look dusty when i became edge i didnt learn we were flat out against everthing about alchohol. i had been told that we didnt drink do drugs and we keep are selfs health and that we were against the majority that do drink. i never took it as we hated everthing about it. yes you have said it all the way since the begining of my time but it never really set in till now.


Health has nothing to do with sXe. And if my parents want to drink I'm not against them. It's all personal choice. You've been some what misinformed.

[XBILLYX]

Health has nothing to do with sXe. And if my parents want to drink I'm not against them. It's all personal choice. You've been some what misinformed.

yea? i feel the same way but when all that are around a milita edge kids what do you think they are for?
then tell me what it is to be edge? if you dont care who drinks how can it be that you think jesus is wrong? its not health its keeping your self clean.

[stepinsideissue]

yea? i feel the same way but when all that are around a milita edge kids what do you think they are for?
then tell me what it is to be edge? if you dont care who drinks how can it be that you think jesus is wrong? its not health its keeping your self clean.


Fuck me here we go again. I thought we did this a few hundred times already. I'm edge. I don't drink. In my life i don't think drinking is right. In my life. Thats not my parents lifestyle though. By my lifestyle standards YES I think my parents are wrong but I'm not going to go against them for thier beliefs. They have the right to thier beliefs.

On the other hand by your christian beliefs you belive that christ is perfect and with out flaws yet by your edge beliefs you believe that people who drink or support alcohol is wrong. You are saying that your perfect unflawed christ is wrong. How is that possible and not a contradiction in beliefs?

[XBILLYX]

Fuck me here we go again. I thought we did this a few hundred times already. I'm edge. I don't drink. In my life i don't think drinking is right. In my life. Thats not my parents lifestyle though. By my lifestyle standards YES I think my parents are wrong but I'm not going to go against them for thier beliefs. They have the right to thier beliefs.

On the other hand by your christian beliefs you belive that christ is perfect and with out flaws yet by your edge beliefs you believe that people who drink or support alcohol is wrong. You are saying that your perfect unflawed christ is wrong. How is that possible and not a contradiction in beliefs?

o. i see. as edge its about us? but we dont go against what others do? i see. how i hate milita edge kids they seem to have everything wrong.

[stepinsideissue]

o. i see. as edge its about us? but we dont go against what others do? i see. how i hate milita edge kids they seem to have everything wrong.


Tell me where in any edge song it says anything about trying to push your beliefs on others. As far as I have always know it's been about personal choice.

[XBILLYX]

Tell me where in any edge song it says anything about trying to push your beliefs on others. As far as I have always know it's been about personal choice.

calm down i said i agreed with you i have never agreed with the militian groups. i dont think you can force edge on some one.

[stepinsideissue]

calm down i said i agreed with you i have never agreed with the militian groups. i dont think you can force edge on some one.

I'm perfectly fine. I am not heated. There is another good reason of contradiction. Christianity is all about convert the heathens. Being sheeple. Very contradictory to the hardcore scene.

[XBILLYX]

I'm perfectly fine. I am not heated. There is another good reason of contradiction. Christianity is all about convert the heathens. Being sheeple. Very contradictory to the hardcore scene.

you make me laugh. you keep going back to the topic of my christiany. if i said i am not edge anymore or if i said iam not a christian would it stop?

[stepinsideissue]

you make me laugh. you keep going back to the topic of my christiany. if i said i am not edge anymore or if i said iam not a christian would it stop?


Would it matter? Would it make you have any better understanding of why they don't really coexist? Would it? Would that stop all the other kids from saying they're christian and edge?

[XBILLYX]

Would it matter? Would it make you have any better understanding of why they don't really coexist? Would it? Would that stop all the other kids from saying they're christian and edge?

i see why. so i clam iam a clean christain does that mean i dont go to shows now i dont hang out with edge kids? no it wouldnt stop the others. i dont think what i do will matter to other. but it would stop you guys from hammering me in very topic about the same thing.

[stepinsideissue]

i see why. so i clam iam a clean christain does that mean i dont go to shows now i dont hang out with edge kids? no it wouldnt stop the others. i dont think what i do will matter to other. but it would stop you guys from hammering me in very topic about the same thing.


So if I don't acccept Jesus as my savior, I don't pray or fast or any of that, I've been to church once in my life, can I call myself a christian?

[XBILLYX]

So if I don't acccept Jesus as my savior, I don't pray or fast or any of that, I've been to church once in my life, can I call myself a christian?

no? why would you be able to? most people do but are they true christians? we dont fast either. why do you choose to keep attacking me i dropped my title i told you i see your point. i asked if i can still live my life the same with out being edge and you answer me with questions.

[xsecx]

no? why would you be able to? most people do but are they true christians? we dont fast either. why do you choose to keep attacking me i dropped my title i told you i see your point. i asked if i can still live my life the same with out being edge and you answer me with questions.

in the same way that they're not true christians you wouldn't actually be edge.

[stepinsideissue]

in the same way that they're not true christians you wouldn't actually be edge.


Thank you.

[stepinsideissue]

no? why would you be able to? most people do but are they true christians? we dont fast either. why do you choose to keep attacking me i dropped my title i told you i see your point. i asked if i can still live my life the same with out being edge and you answer me with questions.


You should fast it's all apart of christianity and it's in the bible.

[XBILLYX]

in the same way that they're not true christians you wouldn't actually be edge.

yea i know i said i droped my title of being edge. now can some one answer my question?


You should fast it's all apart of christianity and it's in the bible.

or i am not a jew christians dont fast.

[xsecx]

yea i know i said i droped my title of being edge. now can some one answer my question?


what question would that be?



or i am not a jew christians dont fast.
you've missed the point.

[stepinsideissue]

yea i know i said i droped my title of being edge. now can some one answer my question?



or i am not a jew christians dont fast.
What question?

[XBILLYX]

what question would that be?


being iam no longer edge do i still hang out with edge kids do i still live my life the same just not edge? do i go to shows how can i if iam not edge and cant be part of th scene?


you've missed the point

whats the point of telling me to do something of someone elses religon explian it to me.

[stepinsideissue]

being iam no longer edge do i still hang out with edge kids do i still live my life the same just not edge? do i go to shows how can i if iam not edge and cant be part of th scene?



whats the point of telling me to do something of someone elses religon explian it to me.


You can not be edge andf still go to hardcore shows and your life choices and friends life choices shouldn't matter on how you rate thier friendship. Or weither or not you hang out with a person.

[XBILLYX]

You can not be edge andf still go to hardcore shows and your life choices and friends life choices shouldn't matter on how you rate thier friendship. Or weither or not you hang out with a person.

yes i know that. i mean christians dont belong in hardcoe dusty said so. so how can i still go as a christian.

[xsecx]

yes i know that. i mean christians dont belong in hardcoe dusty said so. so how can i still go as a christian.

go listen to the song filler on repeat.

[XBILLYX]

go listen to the song filler on repeat.

why?

[SgtD]

why?
because it's about you

[XBILLYX]

because it's about you

it is?

[SgtD]

it is?
not really, but you should get something out of it

[stepinsideissue]

yes i know that. i mean christians dont belong in hardcoe dusty said so. so how can i still go as a christian.


As well as I did.

[XBILLYX]

not really, but you should get something out of it

how do i get it? i mean who is the band its by?

[stepinsideissue]

it is?


Yeah I think they even say Billy in the song.

[SgtD]

how do i get it? i mean who is the band its by?
minor something, or other.

[XBILLYX]

minor something, or other.

o that helps alot

[xvunderx]

o that helps alot

That made me LOL for real!

[SgtD]

That made me LOL for real!
me too.

[XBILLYX]

That made me LOL for real!

did it? thats a first.

[stepinsideissue]

how do i get it? i mean who is the band its by?


You have to be fucking kidding me. Billy you poor little boy. You have no clue. Way over your head.

[SgtD]

did it? thats a first.
here's a hint: the joke's on you

[XBILLYX]

You have to be fucking kidding me. Billy you poor little boy. You have no clue. Way over your head.

was it?


here's a hint: the joke's on you

i know.

[stepinsideissue]

was it?



i know.


Obviously if you don't know what band we are talking about.

[XBILLYX]

Obviously if you don't know what band we are talking about.
yea i guess it did.

i dont think thats about why christians arent meant to be in hardcore dusty.
i think its talking about some girl that has talked a guy into religion and made him change his life. but you could be right.

[mouseman004]

minor something, or other.

LMAO!! Thats great, actually made me laugh.

[SgtD]

LMAO!! Thats great, actually made me laugh.
why? minor something or other was a great band!

[mouseman004]

why? minor something or other was a great band!


What was that song they had.....straight....straight as an arrow? no that wasnt it...what was it again?

[SgtD]

What was that song they had.....straight....straight as an arrow? no that wasnt it...what was it again?
beats me.