caffeine

[x_kate_x]

How many off you don't drink beverages with caffeine in them?

[djay]

i dont

[straightXed]

How many off you don't drink beverages with caffeine in them?


All the cool people here don't do caffiene.

[XvagueprophetX]

All the cool people here don't do caffiene.
i'm supposed to do caffiene by prescription but i find it easier to get it from beverages, so i do. can i be cool with an excuse?

[djay]

All the cool people here don't do caffiene.

its not about being cool or not, im insomniatic(or however i should spell it) as hell. i cant drink caffeine

[straightXed]

i'm supposed to do caffiene by prescription but i find it easier to get it from beverages, so i do. can i be cool with an excuse?

Well i'd never be one to say you should refuse the medical advice of a professional because of straight edge but then again i would also ensure i knew what i was taking and why. Which begs the question, why are you supposed to take caffeine?

[straightXed]

its not about being cool or not, im insomniatic(or however i should spell it) as hell. i cant drink caffeine


Well if you don't want to be cool thats fine. I however am totally cool for not drinking caffeine.

[stepinsideissue]

Say no to caffiene.

[XvagueprophetX]

Well i'd never be one to say you should refuse the medical advice of a professional because of straight edge but then again i would also ensure i knew what i was taking and why. Which begs the question, why are you supposed to take caffeine?
it's not a prescription for caffiene really... i'm on this stuff called caffergot. it's 100 milligrams of caffiene and like 1 milligram of ergotamine. i suffer from "chronic migraneous neuralgia" commonly refered to as "cluster headaches". caffiene, as a vassal constrictor, can help but one of the side effects of caffergot is "increased frequency and severity of headaches" which is retarded. also, sometimes the pharmacy only has the suppositories in stock... so i drink soda or tea and everything is under control for the last couple years or so.

[straightXed]

Say no to caffiene.

NO!!

[xsecx]

don't.

[straightXed]

it's not a prescription for caffiene really... i'm on this stuff called caffergot. it's 100 milligrams of caffiene and like 1 milligram of ergotamine. i suffer from "chronic migraneous neuralgia" commonly refered to as "cluster headaches". caffiene, as a vassal constrictor, can help but one of the side effects of caffergot is "increased frequency and severity of headaches" which is retarded. also, sometimes the pharmacy only has the suppositories in stock... so i drink soda or tea and everything is under control for the last couple years or so.

Can't you just get a head transplant? Medicine needs to make some proper advances, its like we are living in the dark ages.

[stepinsideissue]

it's not a prescription for caffiene really... i'm on this stuff called caffergot. it's 100 milligrams of caffiene and like 1 milligram of ergotamine. i suffer from "chronic migraneous neuralgia" commonly refered to as "cluster headaches". caffiene, as a vassal constrictor, can help but one of the side effects of caffergot is "increased frequency and severity of headaches" which is retarded. also, sometimes the pharmacy only has the suppositories in stock... so i drink soda or tea and everything is under control for the last couple years or so.


That sucks. I feel sorry for you man migranes are the worst. I used to get the worst ones when I was little. I'd go in my room throw a pillow over my head and cry myself to sleep and the sound of me crying made it worse. I was like 8 and it was a few days after christmas and had eaten a ton of chocolate and fell on the floor of K-mart crying my head hurt so bad.

[xsecx]

Can't you just get a head transplant? Medicine needs to make some proper advances, its like we are living in the dark ages.

I gots a drill and a license to kill.

[straightXed]

I gots a drill and a license to kill.

whats up doc

[stepinsideissue]

NO!!

??? No as in you say no to caffiene or no as in no DON'T say no to caffiene?????

[xsecx]

whats up doc

can we rock?

I call shaq!

[stepinsideissue]

Bugs was over rated. Marvin the Martian was the shit.

[xsecx]

Bugs was over rated. Marvin the Martian was the shit.

the fu schnickens are shaking their heads at you right now.

[x_kate_x]

Ehh, I drink caffienated drinks sometimes. I suppose I'm not a cool kid.

But, did anyone find Bugs attarctive when he dressed up like a girl bunny?

[xsecx]

Ehh, I drink caffienated drinks sometimes. I suppose I'm not a cool kid.

But, did anyone find Bugs attarctive when he dressed up like a girl bunny?

why do you drink them? and why don't you drink alcohol? or do you drink alcohol?

[stepinsideissue]

the fu schnickens are shaking their heads at you right now.


I guess they'll have to deal with it. Sorry.

[stepinsideissue]

Ehh, I drink caffienated drinks sometimes. I suppose I'm not a cool kid.

But, did anyone find Bugs attarctive when he dressed up like a girl bunny?


Okay Garth.

[XvagueprophetX]

That sucks. I feel sorry for you man migranes are the worst. I used to get the worst ones when I was little. I'd go in my room throw a pillow over my head and cry myself to sleep and the sound of me crying made it worse. I was like 8 and it was a few days after christmas and had eaten a ton of chocolate and fell on the floor of K-mart crying my head hurt so bad.
clusters aren't quite like migranes. dusty hit the mark a little closer... not that it feels like a drill, but you want a drill to get at the pain. it's not uncommon for cluster sufferers to bash their heads against brick walls to relieve the pain. no joke. and the sick thing is it works. all the things that migrane sufferers hate; light, sound, motion etc... cluster sufferers could care less about. it's bad, it's really bad. i can't tell you how happy i am to have kept it under control for so long because when it wasn't life sucked big time. that's why caffiene is a devil i'm willing to dance with.

[xcooperx]

So is it un-edge to drink regular coke?

[stepinsideissue]

So is it un-edge to drink regular coke?


Caffeine IS a drug. It alters the mind and has a physical impact on the body. Lots of people are addicted to it and can't start the day with out that quick fix first cup of joe. You be the judge. By the way there is another thread about this.

[xvunderx]

I don't, but I don't know if I'm cool either?

[stepinsideissue]

I don't, but I don't know if I'm cool either?


You're cool.

[gatsaw]

That sucks. I feel sorry for you man migranes are the worst. I used to get the worst ones when I was little. I'd go in my room throw a pillow over my head and cry myself to sleep and the sound of me crying made it worse. I was like 8 and it was a few days after christmas and had eaten a ton of chocolate and fell on the floor of K-mart crying my head hurt so bad.
i´ve still got problems with migranes sometimes, but they are not as intense as they used to be and they don´t come as often, but when they do and i don´t take any medicine they sure hurt as hell.

clusters aren't quite like migranes. dusty hit the mark a little closer... not that it feels like a drill, but you want a drill to get at the pain. it's not uncommon for cluster sufferers to bash their heads against brick walls to relieve the pain. no joke. and the sick thing is it works. all the things that migrane sufferers hate; light, sound, motion etc... cluster sufferers could care less about. it's bad, it's really bad. i can't tell you how happy i am to have kept it under control for so long because when it wasn't life sucked big time. that's why caffiene is a devil i'm willing to dance with.
but i´m really glad that i´m not suffering from what you do, i think that my migranes are bad. i feel really sorry for you, and everybody else who suffer from clusters.

[xcooperx]

Was Ian really saying he had the edge because he didnt drink coke or because he didnt smoke. I think thats the question that matters.

[gatsaw]

they just recently started to sell caffeine-free coke in over here, in sweden. but they don´t taste very well, i like non-coke drinks better.

[xcooperx]

Coke, Sierra Mist, and Any of the cherry carbonated drinks are the kind I like.

[stepinsideissue]

Was Ian really saying he had the edge because he didnt drink coke or because he didnt smoke. I think thats the question that matters.


Caffeine is no diffrent than nicotine. They are both altering, addictive stimulants.

[stepinsideissue]

they just recently started to sell caffeine-free coke in over here, in sweden. but they don´t taste very well, i like non-coke drinks better.


Still has traces of caffeine though small amounts. Just like decafe coffee and tea. God I swear xsecx had this same conversation some were. Just like near beer or " alcohol free " . It still has trace amounts of alcohol and it still gives the illiousion of drinking alcohol.

[x_kate_x]

why do you drink them? and why don't you drink alcohol? or do you drink alcohol?

I drink Coke because I like it. I don't drink alcohol because it's stupid, there's no point to drink, and I don't like it.. I never said that I do drink alcohol.

[xvunderx]

Was Ian really saying he had the edge because he didnt drink coke or because he didnt smoke. I think thats the question that matters.

Then maybe you should ask did Ian mean start straight edge, and was he an advocate of moderate drinking? The answer being no to straight edge and yes to drinking.

SXe grew up on a lot more people than just the one, and recreational drugs are still recreational drugs.

[xvunderx]

Still has traces of caffeine though small amounts. Just like decafe coffee and tea. God I swear xsecx had this same conversation some were. Just like near beer or " alcohol free " . It still has trace amounts of alcohol and it still gives the illiousion of drinking alcohol.

Thats true of de-caf things like coffee and tea where the caffeine is a natural part of it. but in sodas the caffeine is an additive, so it's not so much removed, as simply not put in. I'm pretty sure there is zero caffeine in caffine free sodas.

Hence the difference between de-caffinated, and caffeine free.

[xvunderx]

You're cool.

Hurray for that!!

[xsecx]

Still has traces of caffeine though small amounts. Just like decafe coffee and tea. God I swear xsecx had this same conversation some were. Just like near beer or " alcohol free " . It still has trace amounts of alcohol and it still gives the illiousion of drinking alcohol.

caffeine free doesn't, decaf does. caffeine free doesn't have any caffeine, because it's an additive that's added to act as a stimulant.

[xsecx]

I drink Coke because I like it. I don't drink alcohol because it's stupid, there's no point to drink, and I don't like it.. I never said that I do drink alcohol.

why is alcohol stupid but caffeine isn't? They're both fine in moderation, both have "benefits".

[xsecx]

Was Ian really saying he had the edge because he didnt drink coke or because he didnt smoke. I think thats the question that matters.

Ian was really saying that it's ok to drink a beer every now and then and be straight edge, so I don't really know what your point here is?

[straightXed]

Was Ian really saying he had the edge because he didnt drink coke or because he didnt smoke. I think thats the question that matters.

Why does a question of a guy, who wants nothing to do with edge, matter?

[xsecx]

i´ve still got problems with migranes sometimes, but they are not as intense as they used to be and they don´t come as often, but when they do and i don´t take any medicine they sure hurt as hell.

but i´m really glad that i´m not suffering from what you do, i think that my migranes are bad. i feel really sorry for you, and everybody else who suffer from clusters.


it's jesus's way of punishing you for thinking he's wrong.

[stepinsideissue]

Thats true of de-caf things like coffee and tea where the caffeine is a natural part of it. but in sodas the caffeine is an additive, so it's not so much removed, as simply not put in. I'm pretty sure there is zero caffeine in caffine free sodas.

Hence the difference between de-caffinated, and caffeine free.


Yeah I'm an idiot.

[stepinsideissue]

it's jesus's way of punishing you for thinking he's wrong.


Doh!!!!

[xcooperx]

I guess everything here is a debate and competition to see who can be more edge...

[drughate_vegan]

I guess everything here is a debate and competition to see who can be more edge...
i don't really think that is true - people seem to have their own view on what edge is - and some want to point out that there are flaws in some belief system when it comes to that and incorporating sxe - as to keep the edge from being watered down. noone here is really 'holier than thou' - and if they are, they usually are brought down to size.

[stepinsideissue]

I guess everything here is a debate and competition to see who can be more edge...


There is no debate on who is more edge. There has been debates before if some people are edge. This isn't a race and there is no ribbon for first to the finish line. There is no competition. There is just sXe and non sXe. Nobody here is trying to play sXe god. There are people who have been sXe for along time and they're simply trying to help educate those who are new to the scene. No levels, no belts, no grades. sXe - not sXe. Simple huh.

[drughate_vegan]

How many off you don't drink beverages with caffeine in them?
me

[xsecx]

I guess everything here is a debate and competition to see who can be more edge...

how does asking someone to live up to their own personal standards count as a competition to see who can be more edge? If you're against the consumption of drugs for recreational purposes, why are you going to use caffeine recreationally? This is a matter of you examining your own behavior and reasons behind it, not about anyone else.

[xlbenlx]

Im pretty sure Im a level 3 edge with degrees in not drinking and tap dancing

[gatsaw]

it's jesus's way of punishing you for thinking he's wrong.
i thought so, but he started a little to early though.

[xsecx]

i thought so, but he started a little to early though.

he's god. he knew it was coming.

[stepinsideissue]

Im pretty sure Im a level 3 edge with degrees in not drinking and tap dancing


And I'm a level 5 vegan. I don't eat anything that casts a shadow. I also pocket mulch.

[stepinsideissue]

me


Well stop. Say no to drugs. Say no to caffeine.

[gatsaw]

he's god. he knew it was coming.
fuck, i knew there was something i had forgotten. (that he could see what would happend that is)

[drughate_vegan]

Well stop. Say no to drugs. Say no to caffeine.
uh - the question was "who doesn't..." i said me - i don't. cool. but thanks for the concern.

[stepinsideissue]

uh - the question was "who doesn't..." i said me - i don't. cool. but thanks for the concern.


You're right my bad.

[drughate_vegan]

You're right my bad.
no sweat.

[xstepaheadx]

How many off you don't drink beverages with caffeine in them?



I dont I'm drug free and caffeine would be a drug

[XLivingEarthX]

I don't even eat chocolate anymore because it has caffeine in it. Does anyone know how much.

[drughate_vegan]

I don't even eat chocolate anymore because it has caffeine in it. Does anyone know how much.
One ounce of milk chocolate, the amount in an average-sized candy bar, contains about 6 milligrams of caffeine.
On the average, children in this country take in about 38 milligrams of caffeine per day, and adults about 200 milligrams per day. While caffeine is not necessarily harmful for young children (or, for that matter, adults), it does act as a mild stimulant by increasing heart rate and blood pressure. And for some children, larger amounts of caffeine (more than 200 milligrams per day) can cause restlessness, insomnia, headaches and stomach irritation.
http://www.familyfun.go.com/recipes/kids/feature/dony199612_ffasknut/dony199612_ffasknut5.html

[drughate_vegan]

I don't even eat chocolate anymore because it has caffeine in it. Does anyone know how much.
good point.. how many of you consume chocolate?

[xsecx]

good point.. how many of you consume chocolate?

there's no reason not to, the amount that's in chocolate is so small that you'd have to eat enough chocolate to get sick before you'd feel the effects of the caffeine. Chocolate has about as much caffeine as a decaf cup of coffee or tea at between 4 and 6 mg per serving. Your average softdrink is between 25-35 and coffee and tea are above that, so you'd have to pretty much eat 6 or so candy bars in one sitting to get the same amount that you'd get in a single coke.

[drughate_vegan]

there's no reason not to, the amount that's in chocolate is so small that you'd have to eat enough chocolate to get sick before you'd feel the effects of the caffeine. Chocolate has about as much caffeine as a decaf cup of coffee or tea at between 4 and 6 mg per serving. Your average softdrink is between 25-35 and coffee and tea are above that, so you'd have to pretty much eat 6 or so candy bars in one sitting to get the same amount that you'd get in a single coke.
is that really the point?
if i were to only take one-half drag from a cigarette - that's still an intake of a drug.
chocolate has caffiene. period. therefore, if you consume it, you consume a drug.
what's the fine line? or.. is ther one? drug-free is drug-free.. no?

[xsecx]

is that really the point?
if i were to only take one-half drag from a cigarette - that's still an intake of a drug.
chocolate has caffiene. period. therefore, if you consume it, you consume a drug.
what's the fine line? or.. is ther one? drug-free is drug-free.. no?

if drug free was drug free, then you'd have to give up pretty much all juice, all bread and a host of other things for no reason. You'd have to walk around with a bio hazard suit to make sure you didn't inhale anything other than purified air. Why should you avoid something if it contains trace levels of something and is at a level where it's impossible to effect you?

[drughate_vegan]

if drug free was drug free, then you'd have to give up pretty much all juice, all bread and a host of other things for no reason. You'd have to walk around with a bio hazard suit to make sure you didn't inhale anything other than purified air. Why should you avoid something if it contains trace levels of something and is at a level where it's impossible to effect you?
well, you can resist eating chocolate.. it's more of a leisure food. that's all. i understand that there are plenty of toxins in the air and such. we have to breathe. we don't have to eat chocolate.

[straightXed]

well, you can resist eating chocolate.. it's more of a leisure food. that's all. i understand that there are plenty of toxins in the air and such. we have to breathe. we don't have to eat chocolate.

You don't have to breathe unfiltered air though, you have a choice still.

[drughate_vegan]

You don't have to breathe unfiltered air though, you have a choice still.
yes. true. yet, i think we can agree that eating chocolate takes much less effort than suiting-up to go outside. chocolate has caffeine. that's the point. caffeine is a drug. that's the point. therefore, we should refuse the consumption of it.

[stepinsideissue]

yes. true. yet, i think we can agree that eating chocolate takes much less effort than suiting-up to go outside. chocolate has caffeine. that's the point. caffeine is a drug. that's the point. therefore, we should refuse the consumption of it.


Chocolate has milk in it. Milk is an animal product. We should refuse the consumption of it.

[drughate_vegan]

Chocolate has milk in it. Milk is an animal product. We should refuse the consumption of it.
actually there are plenty of vegan chocolates.

[xsecx]

well, you can resist eating chocolate.. it's more of a leisure food. that's all. i understand that there are plenty of toxins in the air and such. we have to breathe. we don't have to eat chocolate.

you can resist eating bread or drinking oj, but why would you if there is no reason for it? If it's not enough to effect you then why would you avoid it, especially in light of other benefits?

[xsecx]

yes. true. yet, i think we can agree that eating chocolate takes much less effort than suiting-up to go outside. chocolate has caffeine. that's the point. caffeine is a drug. that's the point. therefore, we should refuse the consumption of it.

bread has alcohol in it. so do fruit juices. alcohol is a drug, therefore we should refuse the consumption of it?

[XvagueprophetX]

bread has alcohol in it. so do fruit juices. alcohol is a drug, therefore we should refuse the consumption of it?
i got FUCKED up on some OJ this morning, man. then i slammed a couple pieces of toast and i am flyin'!!!

[xsecx]

i got FUCKED up on some OJ this morning, man. then i slammed a couple pieces of toast and i am flyin'!!!

make sure you don't wash it down with some chocolate milk.

[XvagueprophetX]

make sure you don't wash it down with some chocolate milk.
that'd be frickin crazy!

[straightXed]

yes. true. yet, i think we can agree that eating chocolate takes much less effort than suiting-up to go outside. chocolate has caffeine. that's the point. caffeine is a drug. that's the point. therefore, we should refuse the consumption of it.

If its only an effort issue you should stop being such a lazy ass and quit consuming anything that remotely contains the tiniest trace of poison/intoxin etc. If the point is being drug free regardless of effects you will have to stop a shit load of produce. And the amount of effort it takes shouldn't be an issue, laxiness will not forward the revoloution now go get in your space suit!

[drughate_vegan]

you can resist eating bread or drinking oj, but why would you if there is no reason for it? If it's not enough to effect you then why would you avoid it, especially in light of other benefits?
hahah-- word. but, the alcohol in bread is "non-active".. no? by that i mean, the effects of alcohol intake are not apparent.. like when you cook with alcohol and only the flavor but not the alcoholic content remain. hmm.. interesting about oj though.. do you know what the alcoholic content % is, by chance?
and.. what are the benefits of eating chocolate? -- besides it tasting good.

[xsecx]

hahah-- word. but, the alcohol in bread is "non-active".. no? by that i mean, the effects of alcohol intake are not apparent.. like when you cook with alcohol and only the flavor but not the alcoholic content remain. hmm.. interesting about oj though.. do you know what the alcoholic content % is, by chance?
and.. what are the benefits of eating chocolate? -- besides it tasting good.

it's minimal just like the amount of caffeine in chocolate is minimal. when you cook with alcohol a fair amount of it still remains, so that's not a good analogy. there has been a lot of press lately about chocolate being good to fight against cancer.

[drughate_vegan]

it's minimal just like the amount of caffeine in chocolate is minimal. when you cook with alcohol a fair amount of it still remains, so that's not a good analogy. there has been a lot of press lately about chocolate being good to fight against cancer.
right on. thanks. i'll check it.

[stepinsideissue]

i got FUCKED up on some OJ this morning, man. then i slammed a couple pieces of toast and i am flyin'!!!


Holy shit you crack me up.

[kelly]

well, you can resist eating chocolate.. it's more of a leisure food. that's all. i understand that there are plenty of toxins in the air and such. we have to breathe. we don't have to eat chocolate.
You can resist eating chocolate? What are you some sort of chocolate hating freak?

[drughate_vegan]

You can resist eating chocolate? What are you some sort of chocolate hating freak?
actually i like chocolate.. mm.

[XvagueprophetX]

actually i like chocolate.. mm.
carob rice cakes don't count, hippie!

[drughate_vegan]

carob rice cakes don't count, hippie!
they sure as hell do.
but, chocolate is better than carob.
speaking if caffeine - any of you ever try herbal coffee? it's all herbal, caffeine free.. and yummy.

[kelly]

they sure as hell do.
but, chocolate is better than carob.
speaking if caffeine - any of you ever try herbal coffee? it's all herbal, caffeine free.. and yummy.
Ok, if it's herbal, caffeine free, and it's a hot drink... isn't it just tea?

[straightXed]

Ok, if it's herbal, caffeine free, and it's a hot drink... isn't it just tea?

but tea isn't caffeine free

[kelly]

but tea isn't caffeine free
Some of those herbal teas are...

[straightXed]

Some of those herbal teas are...

Some of those herbal teas are...not actually tea at all and are more correctly known as infusions.

[kelly]

Some of those herbal teas are...not actually tea at all and are more correctly known as infusions.
Oh, ok, I stand corrected... wouldn't herbal, uncaffeinated coffee actually be an "infusion?"
Better?

[straightXed]

Oh, ok, I stand corrected... wouldn't herbal, uncaffeinated coffee actually be an "infusion?"
Better?

Well, coffee, tea and all the varietys of herbal drinks are all infusions really but if it comes from coffee it would still be coffee wouldn't it. If it doesn't come from coffee then yes calling it an infusion would make more sense. My mum likes 'barely cup' instead of coffee.

[kelly]

Well, coffee, tea and all the varietys of herbal drinks are all infusions really but if it comes from coffee it would still be coffee wouldn't it. If it doesn't come from coffee then yes calling it an infusion would make more sense. My mum likes 'barely cup' instead of coffee.
Sheesh it's hard to try and make a joke around you people....

[straightXed]

Sheesh it's hard to try and make a joke around you people....

Yeah i missed the joke, care to clarify what it was?

[kelly]

Yeah i missed the joke, care to clarify what it was?
Nevermind, it's gone now... it can't come back....

[straightXed]

Nevermind, it's gone now... it can't come back....

Well how will i know for next time? Was "infusion" the joke?

[kelly]

Well how will i know for next time? Was "infusion" the joke?
You probably won't, cuz you don't think I'm funny, remember? ;)

[straightXed]

You probably won't, cuz you don't think I'm funny, remember? ;)

Yes i do remember, but if i can work out the things you say as jokes i won't take them as serious commentry and whilst i won't be laughing i will be able to recognise your brand of humour.

[kelly]

Yes i do remember, but if i can work out the things you say as jokes i won't take them as serious commentry and whilst i won't be laughing i will be able to recognise your brand of humour.
Ah, well then, not much I say is serious. So you might as well assume everything was a bad attempt at a joke (unless it's really obviously not).

[straightXed]

Ah, well then, not much I say is serious. So you might as well assume everything was a bad attempt at a joke (unless it's really obviously not).


Is this the point where i laugh out of politeness and just hope it was a joke you made?

[kelly]

Is this the point where i laugh out of politeness and just hope it was a joke you made?
That or just give up.

[straightXed]

That or just give up.

Well i can't give up, that would be rude.

[kelly]

Well i can't give up, that would be rude.
Cuz I'm ever so polite and well mannered....

[straightXed]

Cuz I'm ever so polite and well mannered....

even if you weren't its no reason for me to forget my manners.

[kelly]

even if you weren't its no reason for me to forget my manners.
Wow, you british, always cool and composed...

[straightXed]

Wow, you british, always cool and composed...

Ami i being made fun of or is this serious? I'm unsure so hahahaha or thank you respectively.

[kelly]

Ami i being made fun of or is this serious? I'm unsure so hahahaha or thank you respectively.
What'd I just tell you? Pay attention!

[straightXed]

What'd I just tell you? Pay attention!


Well whats obvious to you may not be to me so i was covering all bases in case i missed a genuine compliment. Of course on reflection i see the folly of my post as theres no way you'd make a genuine compliment about me so you were obviously mocking me in which case only the first of my two responses stands.

[kelly]

Well whats obvious to you may not be to me so i was covering all bases in case i missed a genuine compliment. Of course on reflection i see the folly of my post as theres no way you'd make a genuine compliment about me so you were obviously mocking me in which case only the first of my two responses stands.
Damn, now I feel mean.

[straightXed]

Damn, now I feel mean.

Another joke, i'm sorry, i really don't know anymore? Personally i would like to say thats a genuine feeling but it could be a funny that i simply don't get.

[kelly]

Another joke, i'm sorry, i really don't know anymore? Personally i would like to say thats a genuine feeling but it could be a funny that i simply don't get. Yeah, that was more genuine.. but nevermind, this is getting all too confusing....

[straightXed]

Yeah, that was more genuine.. but nevermind, this is getting all too confusing....

okey dokey.

[drughate_vegan]

well.. to answer your joking question kelly...
yeah. but it tastes a lot like coffee. i forget the brand of it.. but it's damn good.
so.. there you go.

[Vodka]

All the cool people here don't do caffiene.
Then I guess I'm the uncool person that does "do" caffeine.

It's a gray area for me. I never thought anything of it before, and it was only when someone brought to my attention that caffeine was "against" straight-edge (they were joking, anyway) that I really started to think about it, and now I generally try to make conscious decisions to stay away from it or have as minimal an amount as possible.

I've never been a big soda drinker, but I stay away from Colas (with the exception of Root Beer, preferrably caffeine-free) and any other soda with caffeine in it (like Mt. Dew).

I work at a coffee shop, so I've tried a lot of different coffee drinks, but now I just make/order decaf for myself, which still has some caffeine in it.

And I must profess my love of green tea (and I just discovered sweet tea when I visited NC--it was awesome). Not to mention, our smoothies that we sell have a little bit of green tea in them (less caffeine than an equal serving of a decaf drink).

And there's no way in the world I could go without chocolate. It was a huge part of my diet as a kid, and it still is.

So I guess I suck at life, then.

[XvagueprophetX]

I just discovered sweet tea when I visited NC--it was awesome
wait, sweet tea was awesome or NC was awesome?

and, eegad, why would you visit NC?

[straightXed]

Then I guess I'm the uncool person that does "do" caffeine.

It's a gray area for me. I never thought anything of it before, and it was only when someone brought to my attention that caffeine was "against" straight-edge (they were joking, anyway) that I really started to think about it, and now I generally try to make conscious decisions to stay away from it or have as minimal an amount as possible.

I've never been a big soda drinker, but I stay away from Colas (with the exception of Root Beer, preferrably caffeine-free) and any other soda with caffeine in it (like Mt. Dew).

I work at a coffee shop, so I've tried a lot of different coffee drinks, but now I just make/order decaf for myself, which still has some caffeine in it.

And I must profess my love of green tea (and I just discovered sweet tea when I visited NC--it was awesome). Not to mention, our smoothies that we sell have a little bit of green tea in them (less caffeine than an equal serving of a decaf drink).

And there's no way in the world I could go without chocolate. It was a huge part of my diet as a kid, and it still is.

So I guess I suck at life, then.

You know you can get decaff green tea right?

[Vodka]

wait, sweet tea was awesome or NC was awesome?

and, eegad, why would you visit NC?
Both were awesome. But I originally meant the sweet tea, haha.

I went to visit a friend in NC. I felt like I was in a national park the whole time. Soo many trees.

[Vodka]

You know you can get decaff green tea right?
I usually get the Arizona green iced tea....I haven't seen any of it that's decaf, though.

[XvagueprophetX]

Both were awesome. But I originally meant the sweet tea, haha.

I went to visit a friend in NC. I felt like I was in a national park the whole time. Soo many trees.
sweet tea i can understand. it rocks, right? i think it's what makes the people so polite around here. it's one of the few things i missed after we moved out of NC. but NC itself? bluh. you must be pretty hard up for trees if you think it's awesome here. yeah, it's got a handful of cool spots, but even those cool parts aren't so cool once you take into account that you're in NC. just get your friend to mail you the sweet tea or something, it's not worth the trip.

[Vodka]

Hahaha, I wasn't taken by the trees. There were just so many of them, all the streets and highways looked exactly the same.
It was a nice break from here, though. I always give him shit about being behind in the times and being a backwards southerner. But I learned a thing or two about BBQ, and also discovered that the sushi there sucks, and for that I feel such sorrow for the residents of NC. Their sushi is of grocery store quality.

When I was there I stayed in Chapel Hill, and we went to Charlotte for a few days. The UNC Charlotte gardens were awesome, though.

[xsecx]

I usually get the Arizona green iced tea....I haven't seen any of it that's decaf, though.

so if you found out it had alcohol in it would you keep drinking it?

[Vodka]

so if you found out it had alcohol in it would you keep drinking it?
Of course not.

If I found out there was alcohol in chocolate, I'd stop eating that, too. But there isn't.

Like I said, caffeine's just a gray area [for me], just like prescription meds and sexuality. If you want to tell me I'm not truly straight-edge because I eat chocolate, then that's your business, but to me I'm staying true to myself and doing what I think is right while still abiding by straight-edge guidelines. In the same respects, if you told me that you took a bunch of Valium because your doctor told you to, I won't sit back and say "Wow dude, you're definitely NOT straight-edge," because straight-edge is highly personal, and unless someone is BLATANTLY going against its guidelines, or going against what they believe is true to themselves, then I see no reason why Person 1 should tell Person 2 they aren't edge based on Person 1's ideal standards of straight-edge gray areas.

[xsecx]

Of course not.

If I found out there was alcohol in chocolate, I'd stop eating that, too. But there isn't.

Like I said, caffeine's just a gray area [for me], just like prescription meds and sexuality. If you want to tell me I'm not truly straight-edge because I eat chocolate, then that's your business, but to me I'm staying true to myself and doing what I think is right while still abiding by straight-edge guidelines. In the same respects, if you told me that you took a bunch of Valium because your doctor told you to, I won't sit back and say "Wow dude, you're definitely NOT straight-edge," because straight-edge is highly personal, and unless someone is BLATANTLY going against its guidelines, or going against what they believe is true to themselves, then I see no reason why Person 1 should tell Person 2 they aren't edge based on Person 1's ideal standards of straight-edge gray areas.

why is it a grey area? how is caffeine different from every other drug people who are straight edge avoid?

[Vodka]

why is it a grey area? how is caffeine different from every other drug people who are straight edge avoid?
Grey areas are debated issues in straight-edge, such as caffeine consumption, prescription medicine consumption, one's level of [promiscous] sexual activity, or even meat consumption (since some hardliners believe you aren't edge if you aren't vegan/vegetarian).

I've read the caffeine debate countless times, and it's just as unresolved as the abortion issue. Some straight-edgers are dead-set against it, while others think it's okay.

How is caffeine different from every other drug [SOME] people who are straight-edge avoid?

Compare chocolate to cocaine.

I understand your logic in how you feel caffeine is just as much of a drug as any other drug out there--I just did a lecture on caffeine in my Psychology class. And I think it's great that you abstain from it completely.
However, I think outlawing EVERYTHING with caffeine in it from MY diet, especially things like chocolate, tea, or even decaf espresso drinks, is taking things a bit far.

But hey, if you think that makes me not straight-edge, more power to you.

[XLivingEarthX]

I don't think staying 100% caffeine free is going to far. How hard is it. Whats so wrong with trying. At first it's a struggle but once we give up the colas, coffee drinks, and even chocolate( it took me awhile to remember some things have chocolate in them). Then you can and will feel a lot better inside. It's very empowering to realize your 100% sober (not including brain damage) and happy or content at the same time. I think it's hardly worth calling going to far. I still eat junk food and sweets (reluctantly because that all I can get at school at 8 o'clock at night.) but I leave the drugs out 100%, even though some say it's impossible. I'll try 100%

[straightXed]

Grey areas are debated issues in straight-edge, such as caffeine consumption, prescription medicine consumption, one's level of [promiscous] sexual activity, or even meat consumption (since some hardliners believe you aren't edge if you aren't vegan/vegetarian).

Hardline is not edge.


I've read the caffeine debate countless times, and it's just as unresolved as the abortion issue. Some straight-edgers are dead-set against it, while others think it's okay.

So whats the argument against it?




How is caffeine different from every other drug [SOME] people who are straight-edge avoid?

Compare chocolate to cocaine.

I understand your logic in how you feel caffeine is just as much of a drug as any other drug out there--I just did a lecture on caffeine in my Psychology class. And I think it's great that you abstain from it completely.
However, I think outlawing EVERYTHING with caffeine in it from MY diet, especially things like chocolate, tea, or even decaf espresso drinks, is taking things a bit far.

But hey, if you think that makes me not straight-edge, more power to you.

You know tea has more caffeine in than coffee and has a noticable change in human behaviour, right?

[XvagueprophetX]

I don't think staying 100% caffeine free is going to far. How hard is it. Whats so wrong with trying. At first it's a struggle but once we give up the colas, coffee drinks, and even chocolate( it took me awhile to remember some things have chocolate in them). Then you can and will feel a lot better inside. It's very empowering to realize your 100% sober (not including brain damage) and happy or content at the same time. I think it's hardly worth calling going to far. I still eat junk food and sweets (reluctantly because that all I can get at school at 8 o'clock at night.) but I leave the drugs out 100%, even though some say it's impossible. I'll try 100%
are you saying chocolate causes brain damage? and if it's "junk" food isn't it just as bad as any other junk you put in your body? and would 100% sober include abstaining from endorphin highs like those experienced after rigorous physical activity?

[XLivingEarthX]

are you saying chocolate causes brain damage? and if it's "junk" food isn't it just as bad as any other junk you put in your body? and would 100% sober include abstaining from endorphin highs like those experienced after rigorous physical activity?
No chocolate doesn't sause brain damage, damn get for real. I'm saying maybe brain damage (from drugs) can keep people from ever feeling 100% sober. So what about junk food I am not getting high and I stay in such great shape I can enjoy it. Finally no endorphin highs don't count those are natural inner molecular reactions occuring in your brain from your bodys own chemistry they are great, they heighten your senses. Hell they provide me with 200% sobriety.

[XvagueprophetX]

No chocolate doesn't sause brain damage, damn get for real. I'm saying maybe brain damage (from drugs) can keep people from ever feeling 100% sober. So what about junk food I am not getting high and I stay in such great shape I can enjoy it. Finally no endorphin highs don't count those are natural inner molecular reactions occuring in your brain from your bodys own chemistry they are great, they heighten your senses. Hell they provide me with 200% sobriety.
see, i was hoping you would say chocolate does cause brain damage because it would help explain a whole lot of my wife's behavior. i'm trying to "get for real" but i just can't seem to pull it off, damn get a sense of humor.

just to be clear, you're saying junk food is ok because your physical conditioning means you can immediately counter its adverse effects? and besides chocolate, which you apparently abstain from, what kind of junk food do you consume? and also to clarify, are endorphin highs resulting from rigorous physical activity the only acceptable means of achieving your "200% sobriety"? or would endorphin highs from some other behavior (ie consuming a spicy food or recieving a massage) also be acceptable?

[xsecx]

Grey areas are debated issues in straight-edge, such as caffeine consumption, prescription medicine consumption, one's level of [promiscous] sexual activity, or even meat consumption (since some hardliners believe you aren't edge if you aren't vegan/vegetarian).



I'm aware of what they are, but I'm asking you why it's a grey area.



I've read the caffeine debate countless times, and it's just as unresolved as the abortion issue. Some straight-edgers are dead-set against it, while others think it's okay.


And I'm asking you why you think it's ok.



How is caffeine different from every other drug [SOME] people who are straight-edge avoid?

Compare chocolate to cocaine.

I understand your logic in how you feel caffeine is just as much of a drug as any other drug out there--I just did a lecture on caffeine in my Psychology class. And I think it's great that you abstain from it completely.
However, I think outlawing EVERYTHING with caffeine in it from MY diet, especially things like chocolate, tea, or even decaf espresso drinks, is taking things a bit far.

But hey, if you think that makes me not straight-edge, more power to you.

So I can do cocaine and be straight edge? What drugs can I do recreationally and which ones can I not?

also your point isn't consistant. Chocolate is extremely low in caffeine, so is decaf. Tea however isn't. "Outlawing" things with a tiny amount of caffeine far below the level that will affect the body doesn't make any sense. However not consuming things that have a much higher concentration makes perfect sense. Caffeine is heavily used as a recreational drug and isn't any different than any other drug that's used recreationally. People have just been conditioned that it's ok and doesn't belong with the other "bad" drugs. If I'm tired, I can drink a coke, but if I'm stressed, I can't drink a beer or smoke a joint. That logic doesn't make any sense.

[XLivingEarthX]

see, i was hoping you would say chocolate does cause brain damage because it would help explain a whole lot of my wife's behavior. i'm trying to "get for real" but i just can't seem to pull it off, damn get a sense of humor.

just to be clear, you're saying junk food is ok because your physical conditioning means you can immediately counter its adverse effects? and besides chocolate, which you apparently abstain from, what kind of junk food do you consume? and also to clarify, are endorphin highs resulting from rigorous physical activity the only acceptable means of achieving your "200% sobriety"? or would endorphin highs from some other behavior (ie consuming a spicy food or recieving a massage) also be acceptable?

Nice joke! Hey the only junk food I eat are cookies, I had hot fries yesterday, umhh, and sometimes cake or pie. Hell I'm sober thats what matters I also skate for hours a day so while I can't counter these bad dieting decisions I'm still way healthy, but your right I'm getting sloppy.(damn you college vending machine!) You'de think they'd have brain food at school. Well whatever a person does it doesn't really matter how they get an endorphine high, I could care less, I don't do things for the high (like skate)I do them cause they are fun( a kind of high, Oh well). Point is it's a necessary body function and until we evolve past it there's little to nothing we can do about it.

[XvagueprophetX]

Nice joke! Hey the only junk food I eat are cookies, I had hot fries yesterday, umhh, and sometimes cake or pie. Hell I'm sober thats what matters I also skate for hours a day so while I can't counter these bad dieting decisions I'm still way healthy, but your right I'm getting sloppy.(damn you college vending machine!) You'de think they'd have brain food at school. Well whatever a person does it doesn't really matter how they get an endorphine high, I could care less, I don't do things for the high (like skate)I do them cause they are fun( a kind of high, Oh well). Point is it's a necessary body function and until we evolve past it there's little to nothing we can do about it.
but sober according to whom? there are people who would say you're addicted to junk food because if you tried just a little harder and packed a lunch you wouldn't have to consume it. there's also an argument that complex sugars can be brain food, at least for cramming and what not. and i don't think we can expect to see brain foods like broiled salmon flopping out of vending machines any time soon, even in the most progressive of college campuses. but back to endorphins, if you don't care how someone gets their endorphin high then you're advocating things that some people consider as a sort of drug abuse like "sugar high" and aspertame. so where do you draw the line? how is the use of sweeteners different from the use of caffeine? they both trigger chemical and physiological responses in the body, they both can have unknown and adverse physical effects they both alter mood and they can both be addictive. is it to the degree that these things happen? or the intent with which the product in question is consumed? or just the effort one puts forth to avoid these effects?

[Xrelighthefire]

How can you go without drinking caffeine, whoever doesnt drink any soda or anything is out of their minds.

[straightXed]

How can you go without drinking caffeine, whoever doesnt drink any soda or anything is out of their minds.

Actually abstaining from the caffeine would suggest they are more comprehensively in their minds

[kelly]

Actually abstaining from the caffeine would suggest they are more comprehensively in their minds
I've never been much of a caffeine drinker, and I think it's interesting how it effects me versus people who drink it a lot. I had can of coke for the first time in a few years a couple of months ago and I was surprised at how much it effected me (I was at an event where it was the only non-alcoholic beverage, and I was really thirsty). I hadn't really thought about it before then, because I don't like coffee, tea, or soda, but damn, it really does have an impact on your system, if your body is not accustomed to it.
I don't avoid chocolate though... it's yummy (and hardly has any caffeine at all).

[stepinsideissue]

How can you go without drinking caffeine, whoever doesnt drink any soda or anything is out of their minds.


Then call me fucking crazy. I'm plum loco. Nuts. A lunatic. A mad man.

[straightXed]

I've never been much of a caffeine drinker, and I think it's interesting how it effects me versus people who drink it a lot. I had can of coke for the first time in a few years a couple of months ago and I was surprised at how much it effected me (I was at an event where it was the only non-alcoholic beverage, and I was really thirsty). I hadn't really thought about it before then, because I don't like coffee, tea, or soda, but damn, it really does have an impact on your system, if your body is not accustomed to it.
I don't avoid chocolate though... it's yummy (and hardly has any caffeine at all).


The only difference is people who consume it daily don't realise they are impacting their bodys with cafeine in such a intense way. Thats why i say to anyone who thinks caffeine has no effect on them, they should abstain from it for 2 weeks to a month and then drink a typical strong coffee or something. A very noticiable difference as you have confirmed.

[kelly]

The only difference is people who consume it daily don't realise they are impacting their bodys with cafeine in such a intense way. Thats why i say to anyone who thinks caffeine has no effect on them, they should abstain from it for 2 weeks to a month and then drink a typical strong coffee or something. A very noticiable difference as you have confirmed.
Exactly... which is quite similar to the difference between the effects of alcohol... if you drink every day, you don't really feel the impact of a few beers.

[drughate_vegan]

Exactly... which is quite similar to the difference between the effects of alcohol... if you drink every day, you don't really feel the impact of a few beers.
so why do you still consume chocolate? i know it has a less significant amount of caffiene.. it seems like you have the logic down, yet are weakened by that source. i mean, i understand -- chocolate is damn good.. but, how can you preach being off of coffee will substantially increase your system, by it's own means, and yet still consume another form of caffiene.. simply because you like the taste? isn't that the same as people who consume alcohol.. any other drugs.. because it makes them feel comfortable?
i mean, yes, we all eat food that makes us feel good and all.. and there are also things in the food we eat that might not be the greatest for our body's health. is your straightedge not in conjunction to your over-all health? and rather proposed to the notion of simply being drug-free? i suppose that is the significant difference among straightedge folk - why some go vegan and such - ...
-- how much caffeine is too much?
honestly, 1 gram does affect your body, whether you "feel" it or not..
it still matters.
are we loosing sight of what it means to be straightedge?
or are we beginning to be too picky?
what does "drug-free" really mean then?

[kelly]

so why do you still consume chocolate? i know it has a less significant amount of caffiene.. it seems like you have the logic down, yet are weakened by that source. i mean, i understand -- chocolate is damn good.. but, how can you preach being off of coffee will substantially increase your system, by it's own means, and yet still consume another form of caffiene.. simply because you like the taste? isn't that the same as people who consume alcohol.. any other drugs.. because it makes them feel comfortable?
i mean, yes, we all eat food that makes us feel good and all.. and there are also things in the food we eat that might not be the greatest for our body's health. is your straightedge not in conjunction to your over-all health? and rather proposed to the notion of simply being drug-free? i suppose that is the significant difference among straightedge folk - why some go vegan and such - ...
-- how much caffeine is too much?
honestly, 1 gram does affect your body, whether you "feel" it or not..
it still matters.
are we loosing sight of what it means to be straightedge?
or are we beginning to be too picky?
what does "drug-free" really mean then?
I certainly wasn't preaching, I just thought it was interesting... obviously I'm not overly concerned about caffeine if I drank a coke in the first place. Truthfully, since I don't like soda, coffee, or tea, I hadn't really given the caffeine issue any thought, until I was at this seminar, and the only thing they had to drink was coke. I had some, because it was dry out and I was thirsty. After it made me so hyper and jittery, I decided maybe it was best that I avoided caffinated beverages...

I think that your confusion about the caffeine issue, and the controversy in general comes from a lack of understanding for people's differing reasons for becoming straightedge... The only universally agreed upon underlying philosophy behind the movement is that drugs and booze are wrong... so people approach the question of why they are wrong in different ways, leaving some things more open for interpretation.

You seem concerned about purity of body and mind, while many other people have other reasons for making this choice that may lead to different interpretations of what fits or doesn't fit with their idea of straightedge... for instance, someone who becomes straightedge because of personal experiences with the dangers of drug and alcohol addiction may not see any problem with caffeine, because, while it is addictive, you don't often hear about a starbucks addiction ruining someone's life. Because of the way that caffeine works, it does not alter your mental state in a way that causes self-destructive actions, or loss of control over your behavior, it merely gives you an energy boost.

Personally, my concern is with mindfulness - I want to be in the moment, and not experience things in an artificially altered state. Of course I am consuming caffeine if I eat chocolate, but I feel the amount is too small that it does not put me into any sort of altered state (and as I mentioned earlier, I have absolutely no resistance to caffeine if one can of Coke takes me out!).

Does that make sense?

[drughate_vegan]

I certainly wasn't preaching, I just thought it was interesting... obviously I'm not overly concerned about caffeine if I drank a coke in the first place. Truthfully, since I don't like soda, coffee, or tea, I hadn't really given the caffeine issue any thought, until I was at this seminar, and the only thing they had to drink was coke. I had some, because it was dry out and I was thirsty. After it made me so hyper and jittery, I decided maybe it was best that I avoided caffinated beverages...
right - because caffeine is a drug.


The only universally agreed upon underlying philosophy behind the movement is that drugs and booze are wrong... so people approach the question of why they are wrong in different ways, leaving some things more open for interpretation.
okay - but caffeine IS a drug.


You seem concerned about purity of body and mind, while many other people have other reasons for making this choice that may lead to different interpretations of what fits or doesn't fit with their idea of straightedge... for instance, someone who becomes straightedge because of personal experiences with the dangers of drug and alcohol addiction may not see any problem with caffeine, because, while it is addictive, you don't often hear about a starbucks addiction ruining someone's life. Because of the way that caffeine works, it does not alter your mental state in a way that causes self-destructive actions, or loss of control over your behavior, it merely gives you an energy boost.
well, actually if you consider that there are plenty of people who 'have' to have coffee or they 'don't feel like themselves' i would say that is a control over your personality. my brother use to drink coffee - a lot. and one night he was so wigged out from it, he was doing all these puch-ups, sit ups, dancing -- it was like 4 am (he usually went to bed no lter than 10pm).. he was extremely altered-- on nearly 4 cups of coffee. he also started trembling and such -- i know this is a specific case scenario -- and not everyone's tolerance is this low/high.. the fact remains - caffeine is a drug.


Personally, my concern is with mindfulness - I want to be in the moment, and not experience things in an artificially altered state. Of course I am consuming caffeine if I eat chocolate, but I feel the amount is too small that it does not put me into any sort of altered state (and as I mentioned earlier, I have absolutely no resistance to caffeine if one can of Coke takes me out!).
no state of alteration is really artificial - you know? there is substance use, there is reflex to that use. in your mind/body that is a truely altered state - only if you fraudulently acted in altered state would it be artificial - your body is nature - therefore you must react naturally.


Does that make sense?
yes.

[kelly]

right - because caffeine is a drug.



Yes, but you can't really say that everything that is classified as a drug is off limits with straightedge, because that eliminates the whole realm of drugs that may be used for medical reasons, herbal suppliments, and whatever else...I think that the line between self-medication and recreational drug use is somewhat blurry, and caffeine, to me, can fall in either category. I'm not saying I necessarily believe that it should be seen as medication, but I can understand why someone would have this interpretation, as it is often taken for specific reasons, before going about your daily activities.



well, actually if you consider that there are plenty of people who 'have' to have coffee or they 'don't feel like themselves' i would say that is a control over your personality. my brother use to drink coffee - a lot. and one night he was so wigged out from it, he was doing all these puch-ups, sit ups, dancing -- it was like 4 am (he usually went to bed no lter than 10pm).. he was extremely altered-- on nearly 4 cups of coffee. he also started trembling and such -- i know this is a specific case scenario -- and not everyone's tolerance is this low/high.. the fact remains - caffeine is a drug.


You're missing my point... these people are dealing with their own or close family members serious problems with drug abuse, not with people being "wigged out" on coffee. I'm not saying that it has no effect on you, I'm saying that I've never heard of anyone ODing on it, and it hasn't been linked to domestic violence, job loss, or any of the self-destructive patterns generally related with serious drug addiction. I can understand being less concerned with caffeine for this reason. If a concern serious drug addiction is your reasoning behind becoming straightedge, you could give a shit if someone needs 4 cups of coffee a day... The most destructive pattern that leads to is over-spending at starbucks.




no state of alteration is really artificial - you know? there is substance use, there is reflex to that use. in your mind/body that is a truely altered state - only if you fraudulently acted in altered state would it be artificial - your body is nature - therefore you must react naturally.


I think that inducing a state of alteration intentionally is artificial. Even if your brain is reacting naturally to the chemicals you have introduced, the fact that you introduced those chemicals is still artificial, and gives you an altered perception of reality. You are reacting naturally, but the process for acheiving that state of mine is artificial.

[xsecx]

so why do you still consume chocolate? i know it has a less significant amount of caffiene.. it seems like you have the logic down, yet are weakened by that source. i mean, i understand -- chocolate is damn good.. but, how can you preach being off of coffee will substantially increase your system, by it's own means, and yet still consume another form of caffiene.. simply because you like the taste? isn't that the same as people who consume alcohol.. any other drugs.. because it makes them feel comfortable?
i mean, yes, we all eat food that makes us feel good and all.. and there are also things in the food we eat that might not be the greatest for our body's health. is your straightedge not in conjunction to your over-all health? and rather proposed to the notion of simply being drug-free? i suppose that is the significant difference among straightedge folk - why some go vegan and such - ...
-- how much caffeine is too much?
honestly, 1 gram does affect your body, whether you "feel" it or not..
it still matters.
are we loosing sight of what it means to be straightedge?
or are we beginning to be too picky?
what does "drug-free" really mean then?

so how's not eating bread, soy sauce or drinking any form of fruit juice going for you?

[drughate_vegan]

so how's not eating bread, soy sauce or drinking any form of fruit juice going for you?
hm. yeah. that makes sense.

[kelly]

hm. yeah. that makes sense.
Damn, that was all I needed to say? I need to work on my argument skills.

[drughate_vegan]

Damn, that was all I needed to say? I need to work on my argument skills.
well - there are trace amounts of drugs in those foods...
similar to my argument against caffeine.. so... yeah.

[kelly]

well - there are trace amounts of drugs in those foods...
similar to my argument against caffeine.. so... yeah.
Gotta draw the line somewhere I guess... otherwise you end up with nothing to eat...
Glad I typed all that other stuff tho...

[XvagueprophetX]

Damn, that was all I needed to say? I need to work on my argument skills.
or your ninja skills which are also very handy for keeping arguments short.