so about this whole 'tough-guy' fad...

[xethanx]

WHY!?!!?!!?!?!?

Some one please explain this tough-guy-fashioncore-fag bullshit to me, and how it is at all, in any way, relative to hardcore?

[straightXed]

Originally posted by xethanx
WHY!?!!?!!?!?!?

Some one please explain this tough-guy-fashioncore-fag bullshit to me, and how it is at all, in any way, relative to hardcore?

ever heard that song tough guy by the beastie boys, thats a cool song :)

Umm, maybe they really are just that tough, i dunno its lame.

[xsecx]

Originally posted by straightXed
ever heard that song tough guy by the beastie boys, thats a cool song :)

Umm, maybe they really are just that tough, i dunno its lame.

are you talking about tough guys or are you talking about fashion core kids?
I wouldn't call tough guys a fad in hardcore since they've been around since it started.

[xethanx]

well then when did hardcore start? I was under the impression it was an evolution, so there for, tough guys would have had to come along at a later date too... I think.... (o_O) - ?

[xsecx]

Originally posted by xethanx
well then when did hardcore start? I was under the impression it was an evolution, so there for, tough guys would have had to come along at a later date too... I think.... (o_O) - ?

the whole point of hardcore was that it was harder and tougher than punk.

[xethanx]

it also was to fulfill all that the punk scene lacked: unity, pride, brotherhood, fortitude....

[xsecx]

Originally posted by xethanx
it also was to fulfill all that the punk scene lacked: unity, pride, brotherhood, fortitude....

I can't tell if you're being serious or sarcastic.

[xethanx]

serious, though it's kinda just a dream I guess....

[X magma X]

sorryu to break it to you bro, but there's never been any unity in the hardcore scene, it's much like the shit in high school.

however, this tough guy shit is an off shoot of that mr. 95 shit during one king down and diecast were in their prime. it's always existed, but it has flourished over these years and it'll eventually die out, just like hardcore did.

[xsecx]

Originally posted by X magma X
sorryu to break it to you bro, but there's never been any unity in the hardcore scene, it's much like the shit in high school.

however, this tough guy shit is an off shoot of that mr. 95 shit during one king down and diecast were in their prime. it's always existed, but it has flourished over these years and it'll eventually die out, just like hardcore did.

how has hardcore died?

also, one king down was never a tough guy band and every time I ever saw them there was never any sort of problem. it's like you guys forgot about DMS, forgot about agnostic front. forgot about the NYC vs Boston fights.

[xvunderx]

Originally posted by xethanx
it also was to fulfill all that the punk scene lacked: unity, pride, brotherhood, fortitude....

Oh yeah I forgot it was a boys club for guys who didn't like Cigars. Should all the ladies present start taking their clothes of and wiggling seductivly now or later?

[xvunderx]

Originally posted by xsecx
how has hardcore died?



I'm guessing he read on of those fake suicide posts that are so hip right now.

[xethanx]

magma, what the hell are you talking about? I have put on one king down shows, and out of the 700 people I remember seeing there I don't recall tough guys, or any problems. also how has hadrcore died? it MA there is no music scene at all, but in other places like CA and UT and every where else that's not new england it's doing pretty well. if anything it's becoming painfully obvious that hardcore is about to, if it hasent already, sold out.

it's become a major market, where you have to pay $15-30 bucks to see a 'hardcore show' and another $12-15 to buy a cd from a band that sounds like the top producers that did all the inflames cds managed it.

I mean yea sure I put on shows, I record and I have a label. But for a show I have never charged more than $6, I will be selling probably most of my cd's for $5 and I have some of the cheapest recording rates you can find.

what has happened to hard core is it has become about immage and money, which is funny cause it has nothing to do with either.

-fin-

[X magma X]

Originally posted by xsecx
how has hardcore died?

also, one king down was never a tough guy band and every time I ever saw them there was never any sort of problem. it's like you guys forgot about DMS, forgot about agnostic front. forgot about the NYC vs Boston fights.

hardcore has died because of people's shitty attitudes, the SICK MOSH has completely ruined the scene and if it's not that then there's the I"VE BEEN HERE FOREVER guys who ruin it for everyone else, turning hardcore into closed group for the selected few.

one king down is a mere example. DMS and NYC V.S. Boston backs my arguement that that stupid tough guy tenison crap has been around for years. it didn't just "come up" recently.


Originally posted by xethanx
[B]magma, what the hell are you talking about? I have put on one king down shows, and out of the 700 people I remember seeing there I don't recall tough guys, or any problems. also how has hadrcore died? it MA there is no music scene at all, but in other places like CA and UT and every where else that's not new england it's doing pretty well. if anything it's becoming painfully obvious that hardcore is about to, if it hasent already, sold out.

i think you've forgotten or haven't heard about that massive brawl at the Diecast One King Down show when everyone at that show pretty much got the beat down of a lifetime because from my understanding the singer of diecast found it appropraite to say "that kid's jewish, beat him up" and it esclated into a slobberknocker. hatebreed, buried alive, madball, skarhead, etc, these bands have always attracted the HIYA SPINKICK kids, perhaps you don't classify dancing like that as tough guy, but anyone whose flaunting off his new X NINJA X SKILLS X in the mosh pit is obvisiously trying to intimidate everyone.


it's become a major market, where you have to pay $15-30 bucks to see a 'hardcore show' and another $12-15 to buy a cd from a band that sounds like the top producers that did all the inflames cds managed it.
I mean yea sure I put on shows, I record and I have a label. But for a show I have never charged more than $6, I will be selling probably most of my cd's for $5 and I have some of the cheapest recording rates you can find.
what has happened to hard core is it has become about immage and money, which is funny cause it has nothing to do with either.


well you can thank labels like trustkill for that one, they fucked that whole shit up for the rest of us. anyone who promotes their band to that extend is obvisiously loosing touch with thier roots, but what does this have to do with tough guys?

[xethanx]

that last part didn't have anything to do with tough guys. just a statement.


I'm just saying that there is a new re-vamped trend in the scene and it is tough guys. it use to be that oldschool-revamp-music-3rd-golden-age-thingy, then those fucking fashion core fags (which are unfortunely still around) and now it seems that the new fad in the scene (cause god forbid people think on there own!!) is tough guy.... and it's getting alot worce than I remember it being in the past.

[xsecx]

Originally posted by X magma X
hardcore has died because of people's shitty attitudes, the SICK MOSH has completely ruined the scene and if it's not that then there's the I"VE BEEN HERE FOREVER guys who ruin it for everyone else, turning hardcore into closed group for the selected few.

one king down is a mere example. DMS and NYC V.S. Boston backs my arguement that that stupid tough guy tenison crap has been around for years. it didn't just "come up" recently.


It also isn't leading to the death of anything either. Why do you think youth crew came about? why do you think a bunch of posi core bands came about? There is a difference between something sucking and something being dead. Are there still hardcore bands? Can you still go to hardcore shows? Then it's not dead. Hardcore and straight edge are amazingly cyclical. You just have to look at the history for it. And more likely than not with some work and effort it'll swing back but declaring it dead is the easy way out.




well you can thank labels like trustkill for that one, they fucked that whole shit up for the rest of us. anyone who promotes their band to that extend is obvisiously loosing touch with thier roots, but what does this have to do with tough guys?

bands and labels don't dictate how people react to things.

[flame_still_burns]

any sort of music that is loud and aggressive is going to attract tough guys or guys who want you to think they are tough.

SSD were portraying a tough guy image in the early 80's.

harley flanagan and john blodclot were toughguys.

the NYHC scene has always had a steady stream of toughguy bands.

throughout the short history of hardcore there have always been toughguys. hardcore is also somewhat cyclical... right now the flavor of the month is having sleeves, brass knuckles, and acting hard. it'll pass, then come back.

[xethanx]

your right.
let's just hope it passes fast.... and that we can skip the 4th golden age of revamped old school too. I mean I like old school, but when EVERY ONE is playing it, it kinda gets old and tired quick.

[X magma X]

Originally posted by xsecx
bands and labels don't dictate how people react to things. [/B]

that's why i said what does that have to do with tough guys. i just get made at the fact that these labels think there's money to be made off of hardcore.

and this trend will pass and when it does and the youth crew comes back i'll be there. but just because tough guy is in doesn't mean i'm not going to stick up for what i believe. i will continue to be a posi crucial duder. haha

[No_Crutch]

bands and labels don't dictate how people react to things.

I would have to disagree with that-
I am from Reno and we have it pretty bad with the whole macho/tough guy mentality.
And I would have to blame a lot of our problems on the bands, a few years back there was a band from here called Unconquered and a lot of the people who associated with those guys are jerks and assholes who go around fighting and terrorizing people at shows. Unconquered also started a new breed of sXe kids who have in turn perpetuated those old ways. As for larger bands, the only big bands that come through Reno are bands that do not have a positive message, Bane, Comeback Kid, Champion, none of these bands have ever come through here. However Hoods, Terror, Throwdown and all of those guys come here anually. So the kids here just mimic what they here and see, to an extent. Not saying that ALL of the sXe kids in Reno are impressionable and subject to follow trends, but a lot of kids have recently go into Edge, and mainly because of some of the afformentioned bands. I can't really say how it is in other places, but I know in Reno there is a direct correlation between Tough Guy bands, and Tough Guys assholes who like to start fights.

Just read Throwdown's journal on Trustkill about the Reno show a couple of weeks back...and that is just one side of that story.

[xsecx]

Originally posted by No_Crutch
I would have to disagree with that-
I am from Reno and we have it pretty bad with the whole macho/tough guy mentality.
And I would have to blame a lot of our problems on the bands, a few years back there was a band from here called Unconquered and a lot of the people who associated with those guys are jerks and assholes who go around fighting and terrorizing people at shows. Unconquered also started a new breed of sXe kids who have in turn perpetuated those old ways. As for larger bands, the only big bands that come through Reno are bands that do not have a positive message, Bane, Comeback Kid, Champion, none of these bands have ever come through here. However Hoods, Terror, Throwdown and all of those guys come here anually. So the kids here just mimic what they here and see, to an extent. Not saying that ALL of the sXe kids in Reno are impressionable and subject to follow trends, but a lot of kids have recently go into Edge, and mainly because of some of the afformentioned bands. I can't really say how it is in other places, but I know in Reno there is a direct correlation between Tough Guy bands, and Tough Guys assholes who like to start fights.

Just read Throwdown's journal on Trustkill about the Reno show a couple of weeks back...and that is just one side of that story.

yeah, but then you can blame things like movies and tv too. It all comes down to personal responsbility. No one is forcing kids to act like thugs and it's also not like these same kids are thugs because of the music. The scene more likely than not didn't make these people that way, they were most likely that way when they found the scene to begin with. If I go to an AF or Madball show, how is it the bands fault if random people not related to the band at all start fights?

[xethanx]

Originally posted by xsecx
how is it the bands fault if random people not related to the band at all start fights? [/B]

umm... when the singer yells: "I wana see all you mother fuckers kill each other" right before the break down...?

;)

[X magma X]

or like bleeding through when their songs are ALL ABOUT LOVE and the singer says during the break down "alright you fucking pussies! fuck this place up!"

[xethanx]

Originally posted by X magma X
or like bleeding through when their songs are ALL ABOUT LOVE and the singer says during the break down "alright you fucking pussies! fuck this place up!"

man... there keyboard player is soooo hot....

[xsecx]

Originally posted by xethanx
umm... when the singer yells: "I wana see all you mother fuckers kill each other" right before the break down...?

;)

yeah except they're talking about dancing hard and not literally killing each other.

[xethanx]

maybe so, but you know how kids think some time.... (power of suggestion and what not....)

[xsecx]

Originally posted by xethanx
maybe so, but you know how kids think some time.... (power of suggestion and what not....)

yeah, but honestly at the end of the day it's up to the individual to decide how they're going to take stuff. I don't see it any different than people blaming rap or video games or movies for violence.

[xethanx]

mmm... yea.... I guess. I mean... ahhh... I dunno.... I need sleep.